M’s sign Pokey Reese
Thanks to DG in the comments for first noting this, and we get confirmation from Larry LaRue this morning. The deal is for 1 year and about $1.9 million. The team sold Jolbert Cabrera to Japan to make room on the roster and to clear budget space.
This is a terrific move. I’ve been stumping to sign Pokey for two years now. Yes, he’s a miserable hitter and the team can expect to have to pinch hit for him in nearly any situation where a hit is needed. But he’s also a treemendous defensive infielder, one of the best in the game, and his glove is easily worth the money the team is giving him. He’s also a high percentage baserunner, and could be a big weapon stealing bases as a pinch-runner on days he doesn’t start.
This also makes it nearly guaranteed that Jose Lopez will begin 2005 in Triple-A Tacoma, which I’ve been advocating all along. Lopez simply isn’t ready to play everyday in the major leagues right now, and it will be better for him and the Mariners to have him improving in Tacoma than struggling in Seattle.
The fact that the M’s basically swapped out Jolbert Cabrera for Pokey Reese makes this a big improvement. Another move by the M’s that we’ll clap our hands for. Well done, guys.
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126 Responses to “M’s sign Pokey Reese”
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Defense and pitching is what we need. Pokey will be a great addition for the D. If he can provide any additional offense for the Mariners, I’ll take it!
Dave, apart from the clear positive effect this move has on the current roster, does this move seem to you to be an encouraging sign regarding the front office’s ability to judge the talent on hand? Recognizing Cabrera as the lesser option to Reese despite the former’s strange local popularity seems like a positive step, let alone understanding that their beloved Jose needs more time to develop. I didn’t expect this sort of thought.
Are they doing well at self-evaluation? Or is this an aberration?
And contrary to what Larue said, this doesn’t do anything to the financial area of the team.
Perez is just as much a possibility today as he was yesterday.
What I was told at 610 this morning is that Lopez still has a shot to “earn” the starting SS position in spring training (we know that isn;t really true now, but) but that in Triple-A Tacoma he will play a ton of 2B.
Groomed to be the opening day 2B in 2006.
In AAA in 2005, Mike Morse is evidently going to get a shot to start.
eeew.
This should give us a sure fire #9 hitter and a gold glove calibre SS. I admit I had a secret hope that Lopez would come out and have an incredible year but the chances of that happening were slim. Pokey is a real solid signing and if he can hit just .260, he’ll be worth the money.
Why sell Jolbert and not Boomquist?
Ah, but I love the sound of Pokey Reese. He is one of my favorite players.
Lopez/Morse up the middle? Someone order Mike Curto a years supply of Alka Seltzer. I feel for the Rainiers pitchers already. Yech.
Much like the Beltre deal, the Reese signing is the kind of good move that we can expect the team to make. His physical abilities show up very well on a scouting report, and the club has openly lusted after him for about 6 years. In this case, like with Beltre, the physical abilities match Reese’s value on the field. That isn’t always the case, though, and we’ll still see acqusitions of players that are gifted athletes and crappy baseball players. It’s a natural biproduct of the Mariners evaluation techniques.
So, no, this doesn’t really affect my view of the organizations philosophies. In my offseason predictions post, I had the M’s pegged at adding Deivi Cruz for 1 year, $2 million, so it isn’t a surprise to me that they added a stopgap shortstop.
And, to sell Bloomquist, they’d have to have a buyer.
Seems like a lot to pay for a nil-bat, Ozzie Smith-glove SS, but it’s only one year and it does a super job of giving Lopez a chance to become a 2b to replace Boone in 2006 in Tacoma. Which leaves us wanting a SS in 2006 and beyond, but this can be arranged.
Do we owe the Sox a draft pick on this one?
This could give them flexibility in 2006, no? Say we get to 81 wins in 2005 then we can decide whether Reese will be part of a push to the next level.
What are the pros and cons of Lopez learning at AAA versus in the big leagues? I have not read anything on the topic of the proper place for a young player to get experience. Are there any studies on this?
Lopez is not a BAD defensive player by any stretch. Morse is, however, and with Lopez playing 2B, instead of his natural SS or his second best spot, 3B, that combo could be brutal, especially in the range department.
Things can and will change, though.
Morse is better suited as a 1B or LF and his bat isn’t horrible.
But I think we all know he isn’t the most adhesive decal in the sticker box.
As far as stop-gaps go, there could be two seasons of one-year SS’s and then Cabrera could be ready to step up. Asdrubal Cabrera.
Asdrubal? Where can I learn more about him? Reminds me of Hasdrubal – the brother of the great military leader Hannibal.
Paul,
Search the site. I’ve written extensively about Jose Lopez and why he should begin 2005 in Triple A. I’ve also written quite a bit about Asdrubal Cabrera. Site search is a great thing. The box is in the upper right hand corner.
Thanks. It searches the comments too! Can you get the engine to highlight the search terms? Nevertheless, there is more to this site than I realized. Good stuff.
DG – you think Bavasi is looking to start the AC in 2007? Or is it too early to project a 20-year old with one season at A ball?
Oops. It doesn’t search the comments. I was mistaken.
Can someone explain how “selling a contract to Japan” works? How much money changes hands? Does the player get any say in the matter? Thanks.
The Mariners have signed Pokey Reese to a one-year deal. Reese is a “small ball” hitter, as Larry LaRue puts it. That’s a nice way of saying he doesn’t hit very well, as we all learned from the “Small Ball” Mariners of 2003 and 2004. …
If you have the Google Toolbar installed (in IE, anyway), if you search “Current Site” it searches posts and comments. You can also choose to have your search terms highlighted on the page.
Paul Mocker- You really can’t look that far ahead with individual players as so much can happen between now and then. Bavasi and co. just saw the opportunity to make the team better NOW, without doing a single little thing to hinder the squad in 2006, should something even better come along, whether at SS or somewhere else.
Cabrera is two+ years away. Could be 2.5, could be 4. Prospects are a tough read.
DC and I both agree, however, that Droobie is a damned good looking ballplayer.
Selling a player to Japan works the way any typical sale of an asset goes.
There are certian details the two sides have to abide by, both of Japanese leagues and MLB, but they are pretty free to do whatever they want financially, since there are no salary caps and the luxury tax and revenue sharing numbers are based on player payroll, not total revenue generated.
The salaries end up being very similar. The M’s are in exactly the same position with payroll TODAY as they were Friday when business closed for the weekend.
Doesn’t the player have to agree to be sold out of MLB?
Yes, the player has to want to go. His contract is with MLB, not the NPB.
Cabrera is making out like a bandit.
#4 I agree that Pokey Reese is going to help defensively, but try .230 or lower that .260
I am just wondering how much money the Japanese offers to Jolbert Cabrera??!! “multi million and multi year contract”!!!!
#25- He deserves it. He played very good ball for us last year. Thanks Jolbert for busting your gut on a crappy team and good luck in Japan, it’s a wonderful country.
I heard the japanese deal for JC could be for 2+ years at 2.5 to 3 mil per.
Pokey Reese was not a Type A or Type B free agent, so no draft pick compensation to the Red Sox (who had offered Reese salary arbitration) for signing him.
Baseball America’s Jim Callis noted in his AskBA column on December 29, “There are only five more compensation free agents on the market: Type A Carlos Beltran, Derek Lowe and Odalis Perez; and Type B Brent Mayne and Gregg Zaun.”
OK, so here’s my question to Dave – If we have to pinch hit for him anytime a hit is needed, and Lopez is in Tacoma, who finishes the game defensively at SS?? Please don’t say what I think you are going to say.
Ok, Coach, then I’ll say it.
Willie F. Bloomquist.
29 & 30,
it’s hard for me to imagine we’ll EVER need a hit THAT badly.
This is a good point: If Pokey Reese is your starting shortstop, but needs to be pinch-hit for when the M’s are going for the tying or go-ahead runs in the seventh or eighth innning … who plays shortstop in the final frame or two when the Mariners really NEED their best defensive player out there?
In what way is Pokey Reese an improvement over Ramon Santiago?
This is going to be a pretty nice defensive infield. Beltre, Reese, Boone, Sexson. If Boonie returns to his gold glove form at all we should be looking good defensively. I’m sure the pitchers will appreciate it.
In what way is he not? Santiago’s bat is even worse than Reese’s and Ramon has half the pop, if that. Reese is a better fit, athletically, at SS for the long haul due to a better arm and more experience.
He is also a better base stealer, though Ramon isn’t bad in that area.
So instead of taking a huge chance by handing Ramon the gig, they took a safer bet and went with Reese, who has gold glove style talent at 2B and SS.
In my opinion, Reese is better than Santiago at pretty much every facet of the game — defense, hitting, basestealing.
jason
Ramon Santiago hit .193/.288/.251 for a .176 major league equivalent EqA in Tacoma. He hit .179/.256/.205 in Seattle, a year after hitting .225/.292/.284 with Detroit.
Pokey Reese hit .221/.271/.303 last year for a .194 EqA, despite playing through a pulled abdomen that coincided with a 2 for 43 slump that yanked his final numbers through the floor. Before the injury, he hit .260/.302/.380. In 2002, he hit .264/.330/.352 for a respectable .249 EqA.
It’s pretty obvious that Ramon Santiago is a vastly inferior hitter to Pokey Reese, and while he’s a good defensive shortstop, he’s not in Reese’s class with the glove either. Reese is probably, on a day-to-day basis, the best defensive middle infielder in the game.
Toss in the fact that Reese is a prolific basestealer at a high percentage and Santiago is a below average baserunner, and there isn’t really any competition. Reese is a clearly superior player.
Agreed on Santiago, but my hope is that they’ll keep Santiago around a the backup SS instead of resorting to using Willie F as the backup. Frankly the only dowside to this whole Reese/Cabrera deal is it almost guarantees Bloomquist’s roster spot in ‘05…
Ding.
This sets the M’s up well- and if Lopez goes out and hits his way onto the team by hitting his 90% PECOTA or whatever, we now have a great defensive backup.
This also means Spiezio becomes the corner IF backup over Cabrera, which is also a good move, since odds are Spiezio bounces back some from the catastrophe that was 2004.
And the difference between Santiago and Bloomquist is, um, one sucks while being from Port Orchard and the other sucks while being part of the Guillen trade?
Yeah, Bloomquist’s not really a decent SS. Santiago’s not even a AAA hitter, even if he CAN play SS. They both are at best 25th guys, and they both would be expendable for better options. I don’t really see why anyone would prefer one over the other, since they both represent “free talent”.
The only thing I like about this is that it sets us up to really free the Boone money in ‘06. To my mind, there’s not really a positive gain for ‘05, but giving Lopez a little more time to learn at AAA is almost certainly a good thing. But, if he’s hitting .330 at AAA by June, he’ll be up in the bigs…and I’m not sure what we do then.
If Lopez is hitting .330 in Tacoma by June, and Reese isn’t hitting at all in Seattle, than you simply move Pokey to the bench. Not a big deal.
If Lopez is tearing up Tacoma, how about you move Boone at the deadline and call up Lopez? If the organization has decided Lopez is a 2nd baseman then he just substitutes for Boone. If they still see him as a SS then slide Pokey over to 2nd.
I think a big point is being missed here. If this means Jolbert isn’t on the roster, AND Lopez won’t be on the 25-man roster, they’ve just replaced two guys with one, opening another spot for guys like Bucky, who were supposedly fighting for an opening day roster spot. Even more good news.
#40 I don’t really see why anyone would prefer one over the other, since they both represent “free talent”.
In the situation that might arise 30 to 40 times a year, they pinch-hit for Pokey in the 7th or 8th inning, I feel they’ll need a good defensive SS to play the rest of the game. His turn at bat won’t come up for a while (or not at all). Simply put, Santiago is an above average defensive SS, Willie Bloomquist is most definitely NOT and that’s why I’d rather have him on my roster. If you’ve tied the score or even if you haven’t I want the better fielder on the field in the late innings…
Aaron (re. #44): Yes, although as I see it Leone’s the primary beneficiary. Before this I was expecting a non-catcher bench of Bucky, Spiezio, Jolbert, and either Leone or Bloomquist; and I didn’t entirely trust the team to make the right call on that last spot. Now I’m expecting Bucky, Spiezio, Bloomquist, and Leone.
If, however, they promote Dobbs over Le– no, never mind, I don’t even want to think about it….
#32 – If you’re trying to catch up in the last innings, offense is clearly more important than defense. As you said over at leone for third, boston used him well, as a defensive replacement for the more offensively talented belhorn. But why doesn’t a similar tandem work in reverse – in boston, the hope was to have more offense to get a lead, and use pokey to help protect it. Here, if we don’t have the lead, we have used pokey’s defense for most of the game, and then switch to the offense in the late innings. I don’t see the problem.
Can someone post UZR and/or Bpro’s defensive metrics for Reese and Bloomquist? UZR may not be available but I will search for it.
In the situation that might arise 30 to 40 times a year, they pinch-hit for Pokey in the 7th or 8th inning, I feel they’ll need a good defensive SS to play the rest of the game. His turn at bat won’t come up for a while (or not at all). Simply put, Santiago is an above average defensive SS, Willie Bloomquist is most definitely NOT and that’s why I’d rather have him on my roster. If you’ve tied the score or even if you haven’t I want the better fielder on the field in the late innings…
Let’s be practical for a second, Jon. Let’s use your numbers and assume this situation arises 40 times in 2005. We’ll even be generous and say that it always happens in the top of the 8th inning while the M’s are on the road, meaning that Pokey’s replacement will be in the field for two full innings each time, so we’ve got 80 innings of consequence. There are, on average, 4.3 plate appearances per inning, so, we’ve got 348 potential situations where having Santiago vs Bloomquist in the field could matter. Removing walks, strikeouts, hit batters, and home runs, you would expect 246 of those 348 situations to result in a ball in play.
Now, the M’s had a flyball oriented staff last year, but for maths sake, we’ll just assume that its going to be dead even this year, meaning there will be 123 groundballs in play in that scenario. As a rough estimate, we could guess that about 40 of those will be in the shortstops playable area.
So, we’ve got 40 total opportunities for Pokey’s replacement over the course of the year. The difference between the best and worst players at a position are about 1 run every 20 chances, so if Ramon Santiago was the best defensive shortstop in baseball and Willie Bloomquist was the worst, over the course of the year, the net gain would be 2 runs. Since Santiago and Bloomquist aren’t the best and worst at the position, the real difference would probably be closer to one run.
Seriously, Jon, worst case scenario, two runs. All year.
Bloomquist is a significantly better hitter than Santiago, and can easily make up two runs at the plate.
#47 — You’ll see the problem the first time a ground ball squirts past Bloomquist, playing shorstop in the ninth inning of a close game for a narrow loss.
I’m no Bloomquist fan, but he’s not quite the offensive zero that Ramon Santiago is. I don’t see the point of the Mariners staggering through 2005 with two no-hit, good-glove shortstops. You want complementary talents on your roster, not redundant ones. Is there not a hitting shortstop (weak glove) available for less than $1 million?
Or better yet, get rid of both Bloomquist and Santiago, keep Lopez, and use both carefully in 2005 as the the wise elder mentors the brash hotshot … ?
Dave: Your reasoning makes perfect sense … and yet seems counterintuitive in this way: Why do you deliberately want to stack your roster and job assignments in such a way that your WORST defensive option is on the field in the late innings when the BEST is needed the most? If the Mariners don’t have the flexibility on the roster to send out a strong defensive player in the late innings, then I submit the Mariners haven’t assembled the roster correctly.
Ramon Santiago? He makes Willie Bloomquist look good! That was a trash trade that should have sent Bavasi out of town immediately.
It would be nice to still have Guillen at this point…even if he is rehabbing again.
Hey, Rich Aurilia is still available!
Jim,
That’s the downside of starting specialist players. However, you’re only looking at the negative side. You could just as esaily state that pinch-hitting for Pokey in every critical situation makes his offensive crapiness less relevant, since you get to pick your best hitter off the bench to hit for him every time a clutch situation arises.
Yes, it might be painful to watch Bloomquist come up short on a groundball up the middle as the winning run scores, but how often is that going to occur in comparison to Bucky Jacobsen or Scott Spiezio knocking base hits that score multiple runs to give the team the lead?
Ideal roster construction would involve 9 players who are both good offensively and defensively. However, that’s not realistic, and sacrifices have to be made on either end. Whether you sacrifice offense or defense in your starter, you are going to get an improvement at one and a deficiency in the other when you replace them during the game. You simply need to stack your roster in a way that the positives of the replacement complement the starter.
Hmm, or perhaps they signed Pokey as a late innings defensive replacement and Bloomquist is still considered the starter?
The problem with that is that the Mariners shouldn’t be targeting 2005 as their year to contend. If it happens, it happens, but they should be aiming for ‘06 or later, realistically. If that’s the case, we need Lopez to be ready to take over for Boone at 2B, as Plan B is going to be un-appetizing (likely re-signing Boone, I would think). As a result, the team is better off long-term with Lopez playing 2B every day somewhere, and that’s not going to be with the Mariners.
#51 Good call Jim. How bout they sign Barry Larkin as Pokey’s backup?
He can still hit and field. He had a decent year last year (.289 BA, 8 HR, 44 RBI in 346 AB’s). He made only $700K last year — I’d much rather have Larkin on my bench at that money than Blooquist at $350K. Not only do Pokey and Larkin have a history but Larkin and Boone have a history, having been a DP combo with Cincy for several seasons…
Larkin is still unsigned, probably holding out for someone who has at least a half time starting position for him. That may not happen as Pokey may have gotten the last one of those (unless Minnesota decides that a vet like Larkin is better than the kids)…
I saw somewhere that Larkin was looking solely for a starting gig, and might retire rather than accept a backup role.
With the M’s revenue they should attempt to contend every year. Understand they got old have not made correct moves when needed. That is the fault of Front Office not fans. The fans deserve a contender every year.
The FO has spent big $ this off season but it seems now that there maybe an opportunity left BELTRE. Yankees say they are passing..If there is an outfielder in M’s system that projects to be an above average CenterFielder please let me know as have checked Dave’s & Jason’s writeups & find none.
Some years when opportunity presents itself one has to break the bank. Far less risky than Sexson’s deal. A premier position. Great balance of offensive and defensive plus switch hitter in one package. How do M’s not make a play for him?
Have I wandered onto the wrong site? Pretty much everything here has been positive lately, how are you guys going to maintain the “We hate everything the Mariner’s do” image that was pinned on you by the less stathead groups?
On topic now. My gut just feels like $1.9 mil is a bit high for him (feels like paying for the name). But my perceptions are clouded by previous free agent years when $4 mil for Randy Winn looked way too high. Since we know money doesn’t roll over from year to year I will definitely agree the structure of this contract is perfect for the Mariners right now.
Upping the defense is exactly what all the young pitchers need to build confidence and make them look somewhat like a major league rotation. It’s just too bad we can’t find a good defensive guy for cheap to throw in center and shift Winn to left…so that we would have a chance of really making the young guys look much better than they are for trade bait.
What’s all the excitement? Four major leage shortstops (including the two from the World Series) changed teams and we wound up with Pokey? And to get a 230 hitter we let a 270 hitter go? We should have let Jobert and his brother make up the left side of the infield.
another rumor I heard, you guys can hash it better than anyone else I read.
reese was brought in not only as a defensive player but if winn gets traded reese would bat 2nd because of his speed. ok so the rumor I heard (radio talk WAG??) said that winn WILL be traded.
are the numbers I read in post #37 enough to warrant a #2 hitter??
The Mariners have gone from some pretty bad defensive alignments in 2004 to a legitimately great infield in 2005, a huge improvement. It’s safe to say that despite his lack of a big bat, Pokey will save far more runs over the season than a late-game replacement will give up.
And Pokey has some offensive skills: He is an excellent base-runner and base-stealer, and as much as everyone here seems to hate this skill he’s a good bunter. I can see numerous late-game situations in which Pokey should just stay in: none on and none out, his speed is worth trying to get on base; runner on first and none out, his bunting or speed to break up the double play is worth giving a shot; etc.
We should have let Jobert and his brother make up the left side of the infield.
Wait, you’re disappointed that we got Adrian Beltre in lieu of Orlando Cabrera? Seriously?
are the numbers I read in post #37 enough to warrant a #2 hitter?
Hitting Pokey Reese anywhere but 9th is stupid.
Dave –
With regards to the shortstop position and using Pokey Reese as the stopgap, what are your expectations with the Mariners in the June draft?
Do they stand a realistic shot at landing Justin Upton? Would Arizona or Kansas City look to take him or pass due to signability?
“I can see numerous late-game situations in which Pokey should just stay in…runner on first and none out, his bunting or speed to break up the double play is worth giving a shot; etc.”
So if Reese is batting 9th…you’re assuming Dan Wilson is getting on base???
Pokey can also play 2B.
I think this is a great signing for the money. In a year when multiple years and millions routinely went to middle class players, I have no complaints.
They certainly have a realistic shot at Justin Upton. Projecting the actual order of the first three picks in the draft at this point is a total crapshoot. At this point a year ago, the odds on favorites would have been Jeff Niemann, Stephen Drew, and Jered Weaver. They went 4th, 12th, and 15th respectively. Chris Nelson was the highest rated high school player on almost every team’s board; he went 9th, while inferior talent and knucklehead Matt Bush went #1 overall.
Upton could have a bad senior year. He could hire Scott Boras as his advisor. He could ask for a major league contract and a $6 million signing bonus. There are way too many variables to assume that Upton won’t be on the board when the M’s pick.
The real question will be if the M’s would take him. They’re high on several college players as well, and teams almost never draft for need that highly in the draft. If Upton isn’t the highest rated player on their board that they feel they can sign, he won’t be the pick, regardless of the organizational need for a shortstop.
I like this move in that it puts some more “heat” on Boone perform in 2005. 2006: Pokey to SS, Santiago to 2nd, Boone to the rocking chair.
I just wanted to state for the record that I feel this simple move will dramatically improve our pitching situation.
There isn’t a real strikeout threat on our staff and having a good defense is imperitive to our rotations success. Certainly centerfield is still a concern, but I’m no longer worried about squibbers off Moyer shooting past Lopez.
Re #65: Haven’t seen any comments on the current availability of A.J. Pierzynski. Seems to have a bad chemistry knock, but that would be a very solid left-handed bat in the bottom third of this lineup which is overloaded with righties. Also any word on acquiring starting pitching? Is Odalis Perez still in the mix?
The UZR estimates (http://www.tangotiger.net/UZR0003.html) have Pokey at 22 runs above average (20 for range, 2 for DP skills) per 162 games, as a second baseman. Presumably he’s similar to that as a shortstop; let’s assume 20. If he plays 3/4 of the innings on defense, he’s 15 runs above average.
His offense was below replacement this year, but apart from the injury-related 2-for-43 slump he was at least replacement level. He’s been above replacement before (+15 in 2002).
Let’s assume his offense is replacement level (and recall that that means “replacement-level offense for an average defensive shortstop”), and that his defense is 15 runs to the plus side. This means that he can be expected to add about 1 1/2 games to the win column, compared to a AAAA-type guy (which is what Lopez is at this point, although I expect better from him in 2006 and beyond).
Given that $2M/win seems to be about right as the marginal revenue for an upscale market like Seattle-with-Safeco, we could almost justify a $3M salary for him. I say “almost” because replacement level is by nature fuzzy, and unspecatular veterans of Pokey’s quality are always available at this time of year, when free agency becomes a buyer’s market and creates sort of a “secondary replacement level,” or a “journeyman level” if you prefer. The question then becomes not whether the marginal cost is justified compared to Lopez/Bloomquist, but to the Deivi Cruzes of the world; I think that it is, but that this drops the appropriate price a bit, so that $1.9M seems like an okay deal both for the team and for Pokey.
Aren’t the Mariners actually saving a little in this deal with Cabrera’s contract coming off the books, and the money they get from the Japanese club for allowing them to sign Cabrera?
Just as the M’s don’t count those posting fees against payroll, they may well not count revenue from Japanese player sales as revenue they can use.
And we don’t know how much they were paid. What Japanese team was it, by the way? No one seems to want to report that.
Does this signing give the M’s the best defensive infield in baseball? What other team(s) will be even be in the same class?
I don’t think the M’s infield defense will be significantly better than the Rangers’ and thats just from our division. Just a gut reaction. Good, but not best in baseball.
Re: Jolbert’s plane ticket for the Land of the Rising Sun… I’m curious to know what rights the major leaguer has in this case. What if he doesn’t want to go to this Japanese team? I guess I’m assuming there isn’t a clause in his contract that says “We can sell you to any professional baseball team regardless of their affiliation with Major League Baseball.” Or maybe just Japan and not any old pro team from, say, Cuba. Anyway, can he say, screw this, I’d rather be a FA here than play for guaranteed money over there?
What is this talk of Santiago starting 2B in 2006? I hope you meant Lopez!
As a Red Sox fan, I watched Pokey this past year. I’ve never seen a more fluid fielder. It’s hard to appreciate how frantic Nomar was about everything he did until you see Pokey. Nomar fielded like he was listening to thrash metal on a discman that spins just a bit too fast. Pokey plays like Barry White and the Love Unlimited Orchestra are playing in a photographer well next to one of the dugouts. Pokey’s just amazingly fluid.
The problem is that Pokey is also amazingly brittle. He’s hurt his thumb or thumbs in about three seasons now including last year. He also hurt his foot last year just landing after leaping up to catch a line drive off the bat of then Dodger Dave Roberts. And, there was also the rib/lat injury which Pokey incurred making a completely innocuous looking double play throw to first with the runner nowhere near him.
Enjoy what you see because you’re not likely to see a lot of it.
If the Ms need any help getting Jason Upton, we both went to the same high school in Virginia. The same city also gave birth to David Wright. Very strange, but I’m not complaining.
as for back up FA SS who can field AND have a little pop to back up Pokey for under $1m:
just scrolling over the espn FA tracker- Aurillia, D. Cruz, Gutierrez,A. Gonzo, Relaford are still out there and might come in at around $1m.
Without spending hours of research on it…I’m sure there’s also some “AAAA” FA’s out there (a la Cody Ransom)who could step right in for the league minimum.
None of those guys have Pokey’s glove, though.
Wait, the Rangers? With Soriano at second? He’s pretty awful. Just to take a look, I took a look at Baseball Prospectus’ fielding numbers for last year for the Rangers. These will be rates for them, with 100 being average:
Teixeira: 105
Soriano: 92
Young: 91
Blalock: 105
Same numbers for the members of the 2005 M’s infield (using Sexson’s 2003 season instead of 2004):
Sexson: 111 (he was at 113 in limited time in 2004)
Boone: 92
Reese: 104 (112 as a 2B last year)
Beltre: 109
Now, you can argue that I should be looking at more than last year’s numbers, and you’d be right. And you can tell me that defensive numbers are iffy, and I’d agree (if it were easier for me to get at UZR numbers for the above, I’d put them up also). But the bottom line is that the proposed 2005 M’s infield has not only good numbers but excellent reputations, while the Rangers infield is going to be weighed down by Soriano if nothing else.
Re: 79
Isn’t Rey Sanchez a FA?
Re #70 Re #65: Haven’t seen any comments on the current availability of A.J. Pierzynski. Word is the White Sox have offered him a contract, but nothing signed as of yesterday.
Is Odalis Perez still in the mix? Yeah, I’d like to know this too. Though it sounds like the M’s have started the “there’s no more FA money in the wallet, we have to look for trades” story again.
And I’ll add that if the Dodgers get rid of half of Green’s salary that gives them $8M to play with. One use for that money might be to re-sign Perez.
#75– as I understand it, with a player’s permission a team can sell his contract to a team in Japan. Typically, the MLB team will get paid a certain amount for it, and the player will then negotiate a new contract with the Japanese team– once he’s passed through waivers.
Best defensive infield? Whoa there. Last I heard, our first baseman’s arm was about to fall off, and our second baseman’s joints were starting to creak.
#79 Deivi Cruz and Desi Relaford are off the board. SF picked up their ‘05 option on Cruz and the Rockies have reached a deal w/ Relaford.
ESPN is reporting the Pokey contract as a $100K signing bonus, $800K base salary, $300K in possible ‘05 incentives and the club has a team option for $2.25 mil for 2006 with the option potentially becoming a $2.75 mil option and an additional $500K in incenives in ‘06. No word on what the buyout on the option is.
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/wire?section=mlb&id=1959119
So, who is our backup outfielder? I guess it’s Bloomquist, unless the team decides to bench either Winn or Reed, starting Bucky at DH instead of Ibanez (Ibanez moving to LF). Of course, if they do send Lopez to Tacoma, then maybe they’ll call up Jamal Strong? Or is Snelling going to be able to start the ‘05 season?
I would guess ibanez, winn, and ichiro will still be the normal outfield, with reed the backup and bucky playing DH.
Then again, if the mets sign Beltran, cameron might be available for trade.
I think this deal opens a slot for a back-up OF, possible a non-roster invitee to Spring Training. Looking at the big board, Lopez and Cabrera were both among the “projected” hitters but have been replaced with Reese.
Our bench is Wilson and Jacobsen (or Reed/Ibanez), both of whom should get significant playing time, and Spiezio, who shouldn’t. We need another backup IF (Bloomquist, Santiago, Ugueto
, help!) and an OF who can pinch hit for Wilson and Reese. I don’t think the Ms would put Strong or Snelling on the major league roster to be benchwarmers; they rather let them play everyday at AAA.
I like the creativity the FO is exhibiting, specifically when it comes to allowing Lopez to develop in Tacoma next year, and also in terms of having the guts to replace a mediocre (but popular) fielder, with a superior glove.
i think, though, that everybody can agree this deal will be a lot sweeter if reese can turn himself into at least a solid 3 in terms of the bat, as opposed to what he is now, which is a 0. At least he’s a 10 with the glove, but a .500 OPS?! Ouch.
They still need to sign a backup outfielder (e.g.: Danny Bautista), to go along with Wilson [C], Spiezio [1B], Bloomquist [2B/SS/3B] and Jacobsen [DH] on the bench.
It seems to me they badly need a LH bat on the bench (i.e. not Bautista). How about Ben Grieve? He only made $700K last year, he’s still only 28 years old, and he can still hit a little (260/361/424 with 8 HR’s in 250 AB’s).
Ideally I’d like to see them get a speedy good fielding LH batter as a 5th OF. Isn’t Quinton McCracken a free agent?
Although it hasn’t been two months yet, people seem to have forgotten that in DAVE’S PLAN (11/11/2004), Dave hypothesized a signing of POKEY REESE.
And a signing of ADRIAN BELTRE too.
(Now if that KEARNS trade…)
I’d rather sign Voros McCracken to play the outfield.
I think Dee Brown would be a good NRI, he’s left handed and has some pop in his bat, and seems pretty athletic so I assume he playa at least average defense. He would make a nice 4th outfielder if Winn is traded.
Beg pardon, but…
Jeromy Burnitz’s EqA: .283
Raul Ibannez’s EqA: .291
Randy Winn’s EqA: .281
Double-U Tee Efff? Please explain to me why dumping comparable younger players for older ones who are likely to take nosedives coming to Safeco, and who are at BEST washes, makes ANY sense at all?
And Quinton McCracken? Isn’t he going to be reunited with BoMel?
Anyhow, right now, Reed’s possibly the backup OF (logically, that would make some sense). Consider this as an out of spring training lineup (12 P’s):
RF Ichiro!
CF Winn
3B Beltre
1B Sexson
LF Ibañez
2B Boone
DH Bucky
C Olivo
SS Reese
C Wilson
1B/3B Spiezio
SS/2B Bloomquist
OF Reed
SP Moyer
SP Piniero
SP Meche
SP Madritsch
SP Franklin
CL Guardado
RP Mateo
RP Shiggy
RP Putz
RP Villone
RP Sherrill
RP Thornton
RP Atchison
Jim– yeah, but isn’t Voros still under contract to the Red Sox?
#51:
It doesn’t seem counter-intuitive to me; it depends what your late-inning situation is. If you’re protecting a slim lead, you need defense — not offense — and leave Reese in. If you’re trying to surmount a slim deficit, you need offense — more than defense, anyway — and you pinch-hit.
That is, “in the late innings when your BEST (defensive player) is needed the most” is only completely true in situations when you don’t need offense anyway.
In retrospect, the hole in my logic is that if you do pinch-hit and succeed in surmounting said deficit, you have changed the position to protecting a slim lead, and you are right.
Terrific deal? No. That’s a bit of unabashed enthusiasm as Greenspan would say. It’s okay and it is sounding better as the dollar amount appears to be what #87 Jon Wells ($1.2 m) is saying than Dave ($1.9m).
As far as his Pokey’s stolen base percentage. Yes it’s good but it’s about the same as Bloomquist’s (84%/83%). Bloomquist in part time play stole 13 bags in 15 attempts last year. Pokey hasn’t stolen more than 13 bags since 2001. That includes one fulltime year in 2002 and two injury plagued years. With Pokey’s potential for injury and hitting at the Safe, I don’t see him getting back to his 2001 SB total of 25. Plus batting 9th and trying to steal in this lineup will be tough. As a slap hitter Ichiro isn’t patient enough to allow him to go. And if he does go while Ichiro is up, it leaves first base open for him to be pitched around. But if they both get on, we might find out if Hargrove is as big a fan of the double steal as Piniella & Melvin.
More important than this signing is the bench weakness and the current heavy tilt to the right side. Spiezio was hitless in PH duties last year and is only 4 for 21 in the last three years with no RBIs, If Jeremy Reed makes the team he probably won’t have to worry about facing lots of lefties this year.
I wonder how many times we might hear Rizz say “coming up next inning the Mariners will have Bucky, Miggy, and Pokey”. It will also be interesting to see how Jolbert fares in Japan especially telling his car jacking story. Ex-M and current Carp Andy Sheets has averaged 24 HR the past two years in the Central League.
Seriously, this year’s version of Bill Bavasi is not the same character that made all those bad moves last winter. First the Beltre signing, then Pokey Reese on a really good deal and allowing Jose Lopez to develop and NOW THIS from Wednesday’s P-I, indicating that Bavasi is looking to obtain a better option for a backup SS than Willie F…
“…historically Reese is prone to injury, as Bavasi conceded in saying the club will continue looking for an accomplished backup. Willie Bloomquist, as it stands now, would be the No. 2 shortstop. “We are rolling the dice a little bit,” Bavasi said of Reese. “His injuries have been real. He has a reputation as a great guy who works hard and plays hard, but he has had a few times when he’s been hurt. We’d be crazy not to cover ourselves, but we’re not talking about any blockbusters.”
Here’s a look at the remaining free agent middle infielders:
1) Miguel Cairo – hasn’t play much shortstop so probably not a fit.
2) Alex Gonzalez – stock has fallen. Might end up with an NRI somewhere — why not Seattle? Would be a good insurance policy for Pokey injury.
3) Barry Larkin — still can pick it and hit well at 40. History with Boone in Cincy.
4) Shane Halter — will have to take an NRI after hitting .202 for Anaheim last year.
5) Cody Ranson — non-tendered by SF. Not likely to get more than an NRI. Definitely an upgrade over Bloomquist at not much more cost ($400K if he makes the club vs. Bloomquist’s $350K). What a team we’d have with Pokey, Cody and Bucky!
6) A couple of other decent options have disappeared in recent days. Ramon Vazquez was traded from the Padres to Boston and Detroit signed Ramon E. Martinez. I’ve always liked Martinez — not sure why, but maybe it was that great Strat O Matic card he had a couple of years back…
not much else out there on the trade market although maybe Arizona would he willing to trade Alex Cintron… hey, we’ve got a slightly used Bloomquist available, Bo Mel — whaddyya think???
Apparently Mike Cameron, a former teammate of Pokey’s in Cincinnati, did a big selling job on Pokey that helped convince him to come to Seattle (see link below). Pretty strange, considering he doesn’t play here anymore — maybe Cammy’s thinking it’d be pretty sweet to come back here if the Mets sign Carlos Beltran to play CF… Howsabout Cammy, Cliff Floyd and some $$$ to help pay Floyd’s contrac in excahnge for Randy Winn, Spiezio, Hasegawa and either Nageotte or Blackley?
And the buyout of the 2006 option on Reese is $300K.
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/mariners/2002140994_mari05.html
One more possibility for an ‘05 backup SS/utility infielder — Denny Hocking. He was was released by Colorado last July (they used him mostly as a pinch-hitter) and finished the year with the Cubs AAA team but never got called up. He’s always been a pretty useful player, would definitely take an NRI and a $350K salary if he makes the club…
I’m getting a vision…(eats another donut)…it’s getting clearer now….Sexson at 1B, Boone at 2B, Reese at SS, Beltre at 3B, Winn and Ichiro and Reed and Ibanez in the outfield…(munches another donut)…Wilson and Olivo at catcher, Jacobsen at DH. Bloomquist and Speizo and a spring training surprise on the bench. So what about the pitching staff? Especially the bullpen? It’s a mess!!!
Gonzo would be a good sign as our STARTING shortstop. Not much average, but a little more pop than Pokey has. Aurilia would be an option I woud frankly like. He certainly didn’t do badly in Seattle, it was just that somebody had to go. He can play all infield positions. I doubt the FO would bring him back, but I wouldn’t mind him at ALL as a reserve infielder. Rey Sanchez is another reserve I would like. He has hit very well in limited At Bats at SafeCo. When Sanchez starts at Short they can slide Pokey over to 3rd.
Having the opportunity to watch Pokey in Boston this year I can say that while his hitting is not amazing, he was great defensively. He’s a speedy guy and has great range in the field.
Also it will give the M’s fans a great chance to chant: PO-KEY PO-KEY!!
#106 “Aurilia would be an option I woud frankly like. He certainly didn’t do badly in Seattle”
I don’t know what you conisder “doing badly” but a .337 slugging pctg. with no range in the field certainly qualifies in my book. His numbers didn’t improve much once he returned to the NL either…
I thought it was obvious I was joking about Q-Mac (as I assume you were about Aurilia). But what about Ben Grieve?
This is probably the biased fan talking, but with the recent signings I think the Mariners actually have a chance to compete for the division this year. Maybe 10-20%. Certainly nothing to bet on, but Sexson holding up and a couple of the young pitchers hitting their potential and it just might happen in a weakened division. Funny how I went into last year dreading the season after they won 93 games, but this year I’m going in hopeful again after they won 63. At least it will be exciting, even if they flame out.
They will go exactly as far as the pitching staff takes them. If Moyer has one more good year, Pineiro is healthy, Meche performs as he did after getting called back up, Madritsch has a good sophomore season, and whoever the 5th starter is surprises, they could contend. Those are a whole lot of ifs though.
I’m just happy that a lot of those ifs look like they have decent chances of happening. We probably won’t win enough of them to be within sight of first, but I’ve got a little flicker of hope that wasn’t there before.
One thing I really like about this offseason is that I actually get the sense that Bavasi would be willing and able to make important trading deadline moves if/when we’re in contention in future years. That’s something to be happy about once the Mariners are out of the rebuilding phase.
Looks like you guys are making some headway in Seattle. Bill Bavasi must be reading the USS Mariner because he is making some good moves. Job well done!! Just more proof that superior intelligence eventually wins in the long run.
Let’s run down our IF list for 2005:
1. If Miguel Olivo learns how to catch.
2. If Miguel Olivo can rediscover his pre-Seattle bat.
3. If Dan Wilson can be no less mediocre than in the past few years.
4. If Richie Sexon is healthy.
5. If Bret Boone can arrest his decline at the plate.
6. If If Bret Boone can overcome his indifferent defense in ‘04.
7. If Pokey Reese’s glove can save the runs his anemic bat will give up.
8. If Adrian Beltre settles in or even contunes his growth pattern.
9. If Randy Winn can be dealt, OR if Jeremy Reed shows he’s ready to take over in center.
10. If Raul Ibanez can be dealt, or if he can stay healthy, and if he can not be defensive liability in left.
11. If Ichiro doesn’t regress into a .310 hitter who doesn’t get on base all that much to be considered a premium leadoff hitter, and if Ichiro can develop some sort of base-stealing rate and consistency that helps the team.
12. If Bucky Jacobsen can find a role, and if he can thrive in that role.
13. If Jose Lopez can take solid strides in a half or full season in the minors to the point that he can help the team.
14. If Jamie Moyer can arrest his decline at age 43 and be at least a 180-inning, league-average pitcher.
15. If Joel Pineiro shows he’s not only healthy and can find some consistency.
16. If Gil Meche can put it all together the way he seemed to more often than not in the second half of ‘04.
17. If Ryan Franklin can improve along with his somewhat improved defense.
18. If Bobby Madritsch is for real, and if he can stay healthy.
19. If Shiggy can also benefit from an improved defense and actually help the team once more.
20. If Eddie Guardado is healthy and his usual reliable self.
21. If J.J. Putz can step in and close the doors if Guardado isn’t healthy.
22. If George Sherrill is the left-handed spot reliever the team needs him to be.
23. If Scott Atchison, Julio Mateo, Matt Thornton or somebody can step up and soak up low-leverage innings when needed.
24. If the injured talents and not-quite-ready kids in the system — Felix, Choo, Nageotte, Blackley, Snelling, etc. — can not only heal but improve.
25. If all these talents can be knit by Mike Hargrove and Don Baylor and Bryan Price into a coherent whole.
That’s an effing lot of iffing.
Regarding middle IF–did Alex Cora sign with someone? If not, he’d be at the top of my list (especially if we could teach him to play CF and turn him into the new McLemore).
You know, it’s a good thing that the Bremerton Sun has a red-tape registration process to read their online edition, because I’d have posted the link to a pro-Bloomquist article here, and most of you would either be ticked off or lose your lunch after reading it. I guess it hurts for me because it’s written by one of my old baseball coaches, but anyway…Chuck Stark says Bloomquist is “David Eckstein with a better arm and more range — and just as hard-nosed.” Stark also thinks that “if Bloomquist played on a regular basis…he’d hit .280 with six or seven home runs and steal 30-35 bases.” Bloomquist also says he’s been “lifting non-stop” and going back to his hitting approach from THE 12-GAME STRETCH (i.e., his shining moment in his career) where he hit .455 against other teams’ AA and AAA pitchers. Granted, if I was editor at the Bremerton Sun, I definitely wouldn’t be able to get away with slamming South Kitsap left and right, but as a blogger…let’s just say this is the Husky-versus-Cougar hate that I never had.
#115– Cora is still out there, and mentioned as being a back-up plan for Tampa or St Louis…
Am I the only person humming the “tinkers to evers to chance” thing as “Pokey to Buckey to Boone”? (say it fast a couple of times) I’d love to put Sexon and Beltre in there but it just doesn’t come off the tongue as cleanly. And yeah, I know a 6-3-4 double play isn’t the way it usually goes…
#73, and anyone else who cares: The team Cabrera has apparently been sold to is the Fukuoka Softbank Hawks (formerly known as the Daiei Hawks). There’s an article on Nikkan Sports about it (sorry, no English translation that I know of)
http://www.nikkan-kyusyu.com/view/da_1105017488.htm
It basically says “we’ve acquired a new foreigner! Cabrera of the Mariners is negotiating a contract with us and we’ll post the exact details and put him in our official lineup when we finish working it all out.”
This is a great team for him to be joining, honestly — the Hawks have been the #1 or #2 team in the Pacific League for the last several years and are managed by baseball legend Sadaharu Oh. They have several amazing players, and are losing one of their best infielders, Tadahito Iguchi, to MLB this year. So I think it’s awesome and I look forward to seeing him play with them next year!
I have no idea whether anyone will actually see this comment since it’s so far down. I guess the American papers will report it in a few days anyway, in theory.
Re # 114: Some of those “ifs” are really stretches. If all those “ifs” come to pass, then the Ms should win 100-150 games.
Re # 116: The over-valuing of hometown players is par for the course. Some of those homers really get carried away. I was in Minneapolis (’59) when one of the local sportswriters pronounced the Minneaspolis Lakers backcourt as good as any in the NBA. At the time, the Boston Celtics had COUSY, SHARMAN, KC JONES, and SAM JONES.
Re #114 and others:
I like the list. IF nothing else it will be very entertaining. However, I think if they traded Winn that would really hurt us. Like it or not we need Winn and Spezio and Ibanez, especially with this newest aquisition of Reese which I do like ( although another INTERESTING injury risk). We need some left hand hitters, Winn CAN hit. In streaks. Ibanez CAN hit. And believe it or not Spezio CAN hit. In fact he usually does hit the ball somewhere (last year usually straight up in the air). If he can avoid that he may come through as a useful back up. It is possible he could bounce back somewhat and be a clutch hitter off the bench as he doesn’t strike out much. He did hit ten plus homeruns in not that many at bats and can drive the ball. Just so many pop ups.
Anyway, I can’t think of who they could really could get in exchange for any of them (pitching, defensively or offensively). Moving Winn and batting Reese 2nd would be the biggest mistake. It would undo everything good the team has done so far. We need power (Beltre, Sexson,Boone,Ibanez,Bucky, Olivo?), hitting (Ichiro, Beltre, Winn, Reed,Spezio) and more than one or two speed guys, especially if one of them is injury prone like Reese, (therefore: Ichiro, Reed, Olivo?, Reese AND Winn.
Cross another name off the list of potential backup shortstops. Alex Gonzalez is signing with Tampa Bay to be their starting third baseman (never mind that he hasn’t played the position in the majors in 10 years!). He’s getting $1.9 million — that Pokey Reese deal is looking better and better! Gonzalez hit .225 last year w/ 7 HR’s and is a career .242 hitter with some power (but actually has a lower career OBP than Pokey and is not the defensive whiz Pokye is).
HERE’S LOU PINIELLA’S TAKE:
“He’s a good athlete, a hard worker and a player we tried to recruit when I was in Seattle after Alex Rodriguez signed with Texas,” Rays manager Lou Piniella said in a statement. “He’s got a chance to give us 20 home runs out of the third base position. I’m excited to have him.”
Reese’s the piece, that’s fer sure. I’m psyched to have him on board. He’s not as good offensively as McLemore (who got on base), but his glove makes him about as valuable. Definitely the right move for the middle of the infield, AND the FO got him for one-and-an-option, just what might be hoped. That’s what comes from waiting the market out (even if I’ve been cursing under my breath watching for just exactly this sign to finally come down).
The subtraction of Cabrera is a plus as well. Jolbert’s not useless, particularly in view of his defensive positives brought to the surface by earlier insight on this blog. JolCab is the perfect Japan sign, though: good athlete, above average defensively at more than one position, makes decent contact at the plate, but insufficient power or plate discipline preclude him from holding down a regular MLB job. If GMs on this side of the water valued him accurately he’d never see half of what he’ll make in the contract he signs over there, so for Jolbert this is really the right move, and I’ll bet he knows it. For once, things work out well for everybody.
—Now the next move for Bavasi: trade to reacquire Mike Cameron. Come on, let’s make a bandwagon. Cammy is clearly no longer ‘the answer’ as far as Wilpon is concerned. If he’s seriously throwing offers Beltran’s way, it has to figure that Cameron could be shaken loose. I’d far rather have Mike back in center than Winn, and, who knows, perhaps this could be wheedled together even if the Mets don’t come up aces on Beltran.
. . . I’m starting to like this offseason. (How’s the shoulder, Richie??)
Deanna, thanks for the hawkeyes there on Jolbert’s impending venue. Always nice to see the scoop. And it _does_ sound not only like it’s a good outcome for Cabrera but that he actually will have some significant positives for his new team as well given his talent matrix.
I’m a big Lopez believer, but I have to admit I think this is a good signing. It was clear the infield stunk last year and was their biggest need. They have upgraded big time.
The pitching is still a big question which I think will keep them around .500.
Also, no one is really mentioning it, but they currently have a catcher (Olivo) who can’t catch the ball. My bet is that Wilson plays a lot, since they will be just close enough to be in it, but not quite bad enough to be out of it.
I’m a big Lopez believer, but I have to admit I think this is a good signing. It was clear the infield stunk last year and was their biggest need. They have upgraded big time.
The pitching is still a big question which I think will keep them around .500.
Also, no one is really mentioning it, but they currently have a catcher (Olivo) who can’t catch the ball. My bet is that Wilson plays a lot, since they will be just close enough to be in it, but not quite bad enough to be out of it.