Mariners sign Carl Everett
Announcement imminent (update: it’s up)
It’s a bad signing if you have any kind of sentimental attachment to the players who put on the uniform of your team.
It’s a bad signing if you like baseball, because Everett makes the game look bad. You can see this in his fight with umpire Ron Kulpa, or his crotch-grabbing, spitting act towards Jamie Moyer.
It’s a bad signing if you believe that a team’s ability to get along plays any part in their success. He’s been hustled out of almost every organization he’s been in, fought with team members highly regarded by their peers, clashed with his bosses. If you’re a teammate, a coach, or a manager, you’re probably wondering what’s going to happen when you report this spring.
It’s a bad signing if you’re a baseball writer, because the chances you get socked next year just went up dramatically, which almost certainly outweighs the easy quotes and possible ink from fights and arguments with teammates, coaches, and the manager.
It’s a bad signing if you like the Mariners’ family-friendly reputation. [edit: see this later post for a full summary of what happened when with the child abuse saga]
It’s a bad signing if you wanted the Mariners to improve this season. Spending millions to have Everett do a job that almost any minor league veteran could do for league minimum takes money away from the pursuit of valuable targets, like pitchers.
It’s a bad signing if you like to see the Mariners win. Ibanez will move back to the outfield, where he’s below-average defensively, and that’ll hurt the pitchers. Everett’s not a good hitter any more.
2003: .287/.366/.510
2004: .260/.319/.402
2005: .251/.311/.435
Against right-handers, which he’s being brought in for:
2003: .299/.382/.557
2004: .272/.332/.450
2005: .246/.317/.441
Before that, he wasn’t even an average hitter in 2001-2002. The Mariners may be hoping that he follows a 2 bad/1 good pattern. An AL DH hit .258/.336/.436 last year. Bringing Everett in is a step back from trying to get over 80 wins.
There’s a chance that this all works out. Everett behaves for a year, provides power as a DH that we haven’t seen from him in years, and the team gets a bargain. That doesn’t make it a good risk, and it’s not going to get rid of the nasty smear on the team’s reputation.
It’s a bad signing.
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300 Responses to “Mariners sign Carl Everett”
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I like it… It’s only 1 year if he mis behaves send him home… The guy hit 23 HRs last year not to bad… Good job Bavasi
Poop.
What does this say about Bill Bavasi and his baseball acumen?
As an uber-fan, this is quite the gut punch.
I don’t know how I can root for a team with him on it.
shigelojoe said it. This is terrible there’s no two ways about it. I’ve hated Everett from the first time I saw him play. On the plus side, I was at the Moyer-crotch-grabbing game and was sitting very close. I know for a fact that he heard me when I yelled at top volume, “It’s Jamie Moyer, you got hit harder than that in Little League you PUSSY!” It was directly after I yelled that he took his base. I think I can take credit for shaming him into moving on there.
Crud. I had literally *just* hit the ’send’ button on my email to the M’s to try to avoid this. So much for *that* grassroots effort.
I’m not happy with this signing at all. What a waste of money and roster space for a bad person and a below average player.
The last time the M’s signed a shell of a former mediocre player coming off a World Series championship, it didn’t work out too well. Why is this going to be any better?
What does this say about Bill Bavasi and his baseball acumen?
In my opinion, it says the odds just got better that said acumen will not be used on behalf of the Mariners come November 2006.
Realistically, if Everett blows up and the team goes nowhere, the team will have spent 250+ million for three years of bad baseball and declining fan interest. That gets you fired as a GM.
Why Bavasi? Why? Seriously…how is this defensible? Maybe Bill wants to get fired…
I’m gonna reserve judgement for a later time. Say, October 2006.
My coworker just offered me a tissue, as I’ve been sobbing quietly in my cube for about 10 minutes now.
My wife and I have referred to Everett as “Mr. Spit” since the Moyer incident. This move throws every “family-friendly” rule out the window. We’ll still root for the team, of course, but today’s move makes it far less appealing. I thought all the Darth Vaders in baseball were supposed to sign with the Yankees? Oh, well. Maybe we’ll sign someone else who will be so good that it cancels out this ill-advised signing. Hey, a boy can dream.
Really, that’s probably just about the last straw for me.
In 2001-2, I was a partial season ticket holder who went to around 35 games a year. In 2003, I cut back to about 20. In 2004 and ‘05, I went to maybe 5 games a year. I think I’ll take 2006 off entirely.
There are few people on the planet (much less in MLB) that I dislike more than Carl Everett. And there’s just no reason to believe the rest of the team (aside from King Felix) is going to make up for the way he disgraces the uniform.
The guy hit 23 HRs last year not bad
That’s about all that can be said in his favor, in an avalanche of negative. There is a lot more to winning baseball games than hitting an occasional home run.
I was hoping Everett would remain a city north of Seattle, but this signing is bad. The A’s just acquired Milton Bradley. How does Everett compare to Bradley? I would accept Bradley. Is it too early to start thinking about what players the M’s will trade next summer for prospects when they are out of the Division race by June 15th. I suspect Ibanez, Guardado, and Moyer will again be subject to trade rumors.
#6. Where can I send a mail to the Mariners? I’m already composing mail to most of the Seattle sports writers chewing them out for not having any journalistic integrit on this issue and I’d love to give the M’s a peice of my mind.
Okay, folks, let’s look at the bright side, shall we? For starters, there’s…. uhhh….well, there’s…. ummm…. Well, I guess there’s at least a 10% chance that he’ll do something so incredibly stupid that he’ll get arrested and his contract will be voided. Other than that, I don’t really see a bright side, 23HR notwithstanding.
how many of us (aside from The only M’s fan in Manitoba) did let the Mariners know how they felt about the potential signing?
sigh. and now (according to KJR midday) Carl is something they need, and (somehow) Freddy Garcia has become ‘a stud’, ‘a no. 1′ pitcher who got away ….
I’ll say this in a way that the Mariners will understand:
I’m no longer investigating the possibility of getting season tickets for next year.
Would it have mattered? It seems to me that the FO made this decision at the winter meetings.
First of all, everyone’s being way too hard on Carl. If you’re going to bring up chemistry issues, the first thing you should admit is that he won the World Series last year on a team, that by any standard, overachieved. He has constantly been on good teams and has never been blamed for his team underachieving.
Carl Everett is a moron. A moron of morons. We all know that. And he’s completely insane. We all know this too. So getting all up-in-arms about Carl’s antics is like buying a five-yeay old poorly trained dog and getting angry when it craps on your carpet. The dog/Carl can’t help it.
Baseball-wise, for the amount of money we signed him(inconsequential, really, for an organization like the Mariners), it’s a worthy risk. As a DH/First Bat off Bench Carl instills a lot more confidence at the plate then Greg Dobbs.
Mostly, I think that acting completely offended by this move is unnecesarry and really a reaction of convenience. Citing character issues and taking the moral ground is all fine and good, but I guarantee those same character issues would be shrugged off with nary a second thought had the M’s acquired one MIlton Bradley.
Welcome to the frustrations of rooting for a team that doesn’t listen to or care about their fan base. God this pisses me off.
I agree with #4’s statement totally. For those of you who feel this way, is there ANY circumstance where if the Mariners are out of the playoff chase in September and he’s still on the ballclub, you’d root for him with a runner on second and third with the M’s down 1? I’ve been trying and i just can’t…
Mostly, I think that acting completely offended by this move is unnecesarry and really a reaction of convenience.
That’s a mighty big accusation to swing around.
Citing character issues and taking the moral ground is all fine and good, but I guarantee those same character issues would be shrugged off with nary a second thought had the M’s acquired one MIlton Bradley.
That’s an easy guarantee to make, since they won’t.
That said, accusing someone of having inconsistent standards based on hypothetical inconsistent examples is hardly worthy of expression.
Not to mention this guy sucks as a player now and continues to be on a serious decline. Personality aside this is a retarded move. Also, the money is important since that’s 3-4 million dollars we don’t get to spend on someone who can actually help the team.
All I’m saying is that, in my opinion, Carl is more of a lunatic than a bad person. That’s number one.
And second, no one here was very shy in their support of the Bradley move for the A’s. Am I to believe that you would favor that move for the A’s, but if it were the M’s the reaction would suddenly change and everyone would be offended that we picked up someone with those “character issues”.
Okay, here’s my basic take:
The M’s just signed the hitting equivalent of Shigetoshi Hasegawa. Past his prime bit-part who will provide below average production for $3 million in a non-critical role.
The M’s just wasted $3 million. I think we all agree on that.
But I don’t think this move hurts the M’s on the field all that much, at least not for very long. If Everett’s as lame as we all think he is, he won’t last very long in the starting line-up. The M’s aren’t going to live with Everett at DH hitting .250 with middling power if they’re actually contending. At that point, they’ll look to upgrade the DH spot and bring Everett off the bench as a pinch-hitter, where he’d actually have some value as a player.
There’s almost no scenario I can see where Everett gets 500 at-bats and sucks. If he gets significant playing time, its because he’s outperformed what we expected. He’s not going to be handed a job and left to wallow all season if the M’s are in any kind of wild card contention. And acquiring a DH at midseason isn’t all tha that hard to do.
In no way is this a good move. But it’s also not the worst on-field acquisition ever. He won’t help the team win, but he’s unlikely to be a huge barrier to the team winning, either.
Oh Mariners. To quote an stegosaurus I know*, “Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal!”
* and who was quoted yesterday, I think, in previous comments
and no, I wouldn’t want Milton Bradley, either.
Dave – you make an excellent and very logical point. The move’s still terrible, and I will continue to hate it, but I am no longer planning on suicide over this one. Now, how to make Carl get himself arrested…. hmmmmm….
And second, no one here was very shy in their support of the Bradley move for the A’s.
If you’re going to judge what I write on the expressed views of commenters and other authors, I might as well not bother.
Am I to believe that you would favor that move for the A’s, but if it were the M’s the reaction would suddenly change and everyone would be offended that we picked up someone with those “character issuesâ€.
I would submit that Bradley is not Everett, though both have had umpire/organizational/team problems.
From a baseball perspective, Bradley can play.
From a off-field side, Bradley’s got the same kind of anger and persecution issues. But he doesn’t have the child abuse issue, and he’s not doing magazine interviews where he says unkind things about gay people.
So there you are. But this isn’t about Milton Bradley, or what you think I might have written if they’d pursued him, and how what you think I might have written if they’d pursued him reflects on my criticism of this signing.
[deleted extremely long URL pasted as text]
Everyones debated the merits of signing Everett enough already so I don’t see any point to doing so even more. A much more interesting question is what the M’s will do with Raul Ibanez. Are they going to move him to left field or trade him for pitching? I’m leaning towards the latter.
Dave, i’m sorry man but i think this DOES hurt them on the field. In regards to chemistry and what not. Case in point, Moyer is pretty well-received in the clubhouse and at the very least respected by the “boys” how can his relationship be anything but contentious with Everett? That has to affect morale which will in turn affect performance. At least marginally and possibly quite a bit.
Do you have a link or some source that’s confirming this? So far, it’s only the been the Seattle Times reporting the interest. I’d like to see something more concrete before I pass any judgement.
#32– there were the problems this summer for Milton and his wife…
Announcement is coming this afternoon, southpaw.
Mediocre ballplayer, bad character, probably loony. What more needs to be said? A complete waste of $3 million dollars.
But I guess beggars can’t be choosers. And that’s clearly what the Mariners are now – beggars.
“…he says unkind things about gay people.”
Derek, could you elaborate on what these unkind things are becuase it’s become fashionable to make fun of Everett for his views on homosexuality without anyone actually quoting what he said. If you’ve quoted him in an earlier thread, just point me in that direction.
#32
What a terrible overstatement of Everett’s past, DMZ. He “neglected” those bruises onto his kids. No child “abuse” here, just simple, forgivable, everybody-else-does-it-right? “neglect.”
First off, Milton Bradley is not exactly the same thing as Carl Everett and people should stop trying to make it so.
Second, this to me just shows an absolute lack of judgement on where character issues play a part in baseball… they will cripple a team by overpaying under-producing nice, local boys… but sign freaking Everett???
That’s like being late to work because you take the stairs instead of the escalator to watch your weight… but getting off the escalator at Mrs. Field’s Cookies and ordering three dozen.
They screw themselves at both ends of the issue, by being unreasonable in either direction.
Bah.
Yes, it’s the three million bones that really offends me.
There are better things to do with three million dollars, and that probably includes burying them in a disused coalmine and letting unemployed indigents dig them out.
I just. Don’t. Believe it. Ibanez to left, bad. Everett to clubhouse, bad. Another declining vet gets a chance in Seattle, bad. Man…what’s the supposed freaking point of this signing again?
Sure it’s for one year and by current standards, Carl’s making chump change, but i’m depressed knowing our already slim chances for signing Millwood probably evaporated!
The best thing that can happen from today’s signing is that BB is canned before the end of the 06 season.
How about Epstein? He’s available last I heard romping it in South America with Pearl Jam! Now that would be a boost.
Would your opinion of that change if you could add Everett’s 2005 salary to whoever we sign for the rotation and get Kevin Millwood’s 2005 salary- or if there’s a 9-12 million dollar player available come July that we don’t have salary for because that money’s being spent on Carl Everett, and sorry, no expanding the budget?
THAT’S one of my big problems right there- that 3 million forecloses other options, for a crappy player. We’re spending 3+ million dollar’s of this year’s budget because of Scott Spiezio. I’d just as soon not have that be 6 million once we waive Everett in June because he’s hitting .178 and assaulted a reporter in the clubhouse.
He won’t help the team win, but he’s unlikely to be a huge barrier to the team winning, either.
Would your opinion of that change if you could add Everett’s 2005 salary to whoever we sign for the rotation and get Kevin Millwood’s 2005 salary- or if there’s a 9-12 million dollar player available come July that we don’t have salary for because that money’s being spent on Carl Everett, and sorry, no expanding the budget?
THAT’S one of my big problems right there- that 3 million forecloses other options, for a crappy player. We’re spending 3+ million dollar’s of this year’s budget because of Scott Spiezio. I’d just as soon not have that be 6 million once we waive Everett in June because he’s hitting .178 and assaulted a reporter in the clubhouse.
BOY OH BOY..
Bad bad move,It’ll be quite difficult for me to support him when and if he plays for the M’s..
Then,again,the beer just MIGHT help.
(glug glug)
Merry xmas from Italy,boys and girls..
The Everett on homosexuality stuff is pretty easy to find. Someone quotes it at ~the 100-comment mark in a previous thread as well
Amen EC! Friggen 6mil down the tube for Spaz Spez and Crazy Carl!
Why don’t we judge Carl Everett on what he does at the ballpark and not all these other unimportant issues (a past his prime hitter with little upside). Does anyone really care what a baseball player thinks about homosexuals, evolution, religion, etc.?
I had pretty good respect for Bavasi and the job he’s done thus far… until today. For a team that has been spouting the virtues of being a family friendly ball club for the last few years, they kinda’ threw that one right out the window in one fell swoop. I actually enjoyed the good guy image that the Mariners promoted, and the fact that it was important to the FO to create a family-friendly atmosphere at the ballpark, and sign good players that fit that mold. Oh well, I guess I won’t be bringing my kids to the ballpark this year. I want my kids to look at ballplayers as a positive role model, and you Mr. Everett are no positive role model. Bleh…
It was quite nice to send the e-mail. Not that anyone there will ever read it.
FWIW,
Body:
“If this team is indeed about to sign Carl Everett, consider me no longer an attending patron to the Seattle Mariners. This team could have done so much better with that money. There are plenty of players who can hit equal to Carl Everett and ignoring that to sign him is just another move reminiscent of those that brought on the horrible 2003 and 2004 seasons. It shows a clear lack of fundamental roster strategy and as such I can no longer find a rooting interest in this ballclub. Just because I am from Seattle does not mean I have to support a team that is clearly run in a substandard manner. Thank you for 1995 and 2001, but I will now be finding a team that actually tries to win to root for.”
Well…my 2 cents on this. As a life long M’s fan, this deal saddens me, but I won’t stop attending games or spring training because of it.
What cracks me up are the people SO against this deal on boards such as this, the PI and elsewhere are a lot of the same people who cried we needed to trade for the dregs of baseball, team chemistry be damned, to win NOW. NOW we get a question mark in the form of Everett and people are saying they won’t support the team via ticket purchases and whatnot?
What gives? Sure, I hate this so much I can’t put it into words right now. But at the end of the day, if he plays well and doesn’t get into trouble, what’s the problem? Anybody here REALLY think we will be taking down the A’s or Angels this year with what the FO has given us? I hate to say it, but it’s not happening with this bunch.
I will root them on and hope for the best. The M’s are my team and I’ve been through good times and bad with them since 77.
The thing that’s breaking my heart is this Clement for Reed bull. Why are we even considering doing this? WHO is going to play CF? Everett? Ichiro? Strong? Please…if Bavasi can’t do a deal that works without surrendering a young CF MANY in BB agree is an up and comer, than I give up. Why did we trade Freddie then? Reed was the centerpiece with Olivo and Morse being components that had question marks attached.
Sorry for the rant. I am aghast at this deal, but I will swallow it and deal. We’ve dealt with headcases here before (Bobby Ayala anybody? Freddie sometimes? Cirillo?) and this won’t be the last time we see this kind of thing (btw – I am not comparing Everett to any of those folks but they were headcases in my book and Carl is one too).
Oh well…just my 2 cents. I am by no means ripping anybody’s opinions.
I wonder what it’d take to sneak into the Mariners’ sound booth somehow and “accidentally” swap in the Barney the Dinosaur theme for Everett’s at-bat music.
That said, I don’t really feel like wasting my energy angsting over this, until he ends up hitting .050 as our switch-hitting DH come July next year. Hey, does he have any tattoos?
Unbelievable move. Aside from everything else that has been said, one of the biggest assets the Mariners have is that their fans have been supportive with their attendance and money over the last 2 years [or at least 1.5 starting from when it was clear 04 was a dud] to an extent well beyond what you would expect of a 65-70 win team. Even one with a fairly new ballpark. And yet the Mariners don’t blink about making a move for a retread with poor baseball [and life] skills. It’s disrespectful to the fans. I’m usually not into moral chestbeating about athletes but there are a select few of them out there that just have bad news written all over them. Carl Everett is one of those guys.
What cracks me up are the people SO against this deal on boards such as this, the PI and elsewhere are a lot of the same people who cried we needed to trade for the dregs of baseball, team chemistry be damned, to win NOW. NOW we get a question mark in the form of Everett and people are saying they won’t support the team via ticket purchases and whatnot?
No one was arguing that the team needed to get out there and acquire old, washed-up, horrible players who also had long histories of doing bad things.
Also, I object to including USSM with the PI’s boards.
The problem 54, is that he DOES NOT PLAY WELL. Other stuff be damned, he’s a CRUMMY BALLPLAYER. And it represents ZERO knowledge gained from the past.
My email to the Mariners expresses how I feel about this signing, “I have been a fan of the Mariners for many years and have stuck with you while you sucked. I have bought tickets for myself and my family to see my team play lousy baseball. I have supported the Mariners with my money.
I promise you that I will never spend a dime to support the Mariners as long as Carl Everett is on the team.”
“The M’s just wasted $3 million. I think we all agree on that.”
I think that’s the take-home lesson here. Someone in the Mariners’ front office should have picked up the handy USSM guide to Carl Everett alternatives. There are definitely players comparable to Everett out there, without the personality issues, and some who might have been had for cheaper than Everett.
Derek, sorry you misunderstood my post. I was generalizing the posts NOT the writers at the USSM. I prefer your analysis to the PI anyday.
It was a rant and not intended to specifically call out anybody in particular.
But, it wasn’t generalizing the posts either.
Nobody in their right mind said to get crappy players. Some people said forget the fan friendly focus and make it a win championships focus. Complaining about Carl Everett is valid because he, in no way, gets the Ms closer to either goal.
#56… Its disrespectful to the fans that the FO is signing players? Gimme a break
#58… How can you say Everett is washed up? The guy hit 23 HRs and drove in 87 RBIs…
… I have said it once I will say it before this is a good move since its only for 1 year…
… Atleast give the chance a guy to prove to you hes worhty… Don’t go bashing him before he hasn’t done anything
The only rationale I can see behind this move is that the FO thought we needed a straw to stir the drink. Our team is so freakin’ bland since the Boone’s, Buhner’s, Mclemore’s left, that we signed Carl to infuse some energy into the team, even if most of it is negative.
I’d much rather signed Burnitz, Rondell White, Durazo, Travis Lee, et al…
To clarify further, I might add that I have go to many M’s message boards and for years read how many people want bad players/guys because they feel chemistry is a useless thing. They have this opinion that the M’s approach to good guys is outdated. I disagree and feel chemistry is key. From what I saw last year, we had ZERO chemistry.
How many times is that 23 home run number going to get dragged out like a show dog?
It’s all he did. It’s the only thing you can point to. The rest of the time it was out after out after out. By that logic we might as well bring back Boone and stick him in the DH slot. Hacking 600 times a year he’ll hit 20 home runs, after all.
#62 – fair post. Read my post and you will understand I am against this, but am frustrated that people will no longer support the team over one loser?
63, your use of RBI as a measure of his value clearly shows a lack of knowledge into the realities of how baseball teams win games.
#65 if chemistry is everything than obviously Carl Everett can bring some to the clubhouse he only played for the world champion last season…
I just got off the phone with the Mariners.
The CSR I talked to basically told me, “As an employee I agree with you but they’ve signed him so what can you do?”
He gave me some song and dance that Armstrong had spent a lot of time with Everett and that Everett is a changed man now and super cool. Supposedly they talked to Guillen and tons of White Sox dudes who swear up and down that Carl is a good guy now (but of course they’re not signing him again).
If you want to call them, and I hope you do, the number is (206) 346-4001.
I think the Ms have done stupider things than this… $3M/year for 2 years to Hasegawa, for instance. The Spiezio contract. At least this is just for one year, and, who knows, maybe Carl’s got a little power spike left in him. This signing does not reflect well on Bavasi or the front office, but I gave up on them a long time ago. They stumble into good moves but, overall, have no plan. At least the bumbling stops after this year. Here’s the sentiment that I’m sure some of you have but are afraid to publicly admit: Hopefully, things will go poorly enough for a complete overhaul of the FO.
#66 your acting like a guy hitting 23 HRs is horrible… Basically your only point for getting Everett is because hes had some problems in the past… It surely can’t be for lack of production
Oh, and they tried to tell me that the child abuse stuff didn’t happen, and wanted me to cite a source (which I didn’t have handy) so if anyone has a link to an article about that I’ll call them back.
I’m not trying to insuate that you are for the signing Byron, nobody with something beyond “Ooh, look at those 23 HR, 87 RBI” knowledge knows this is bad.
I can’t speak for others, but it’s not JUST the Carl Everett signing. It’s the fact that it shows no gain in knowledge. From Al Martin, to Jeff Cirillo, to Rich Aurilla, Scott Spiezio, Carlos Guillen, et al, it’s a lack of understanding on how to build a good team. I had hoped that Bavasi would change that, and up to now, he had, but this is just pure early 2000s regression and I just can’t support that any further. Carl Everett is the straw that breaks my camel’s back.
I will still root for Seattle, but in the same way I root for Minnesota, Milwaukee post Selig, Atlanta and a few other teams. They will become just another team playing my favorite sport.
69 – Fair point BUT if your manager is Ozzie Guillen WOULD YOU spout off? Many won’t. Even Carl realizes that’s a losing proposition.
A complete listing of players who had been on World Series teams and then utterly failed to bring that clubhouse magic to their new teams would be so long as wear my fingers down to nubs.
However… you could start with Scott Spiezio and Rich Aurilia, who were both terrible here and did nothing to bring grit or leadership to the team.
The thing that really chaps my hide is that our team is in a difficult situation and we pull off something like this. We have all discussed the core issues over and over regarding the farm system, a ton of injuries to our young pitching etc. With the current state of our minor league system Bavasi is in a bind when it comes to making trades no doubt.
What really pisses me off though, is that we have got an incredibly powerful asset that a good chunk of teams don’t have – money. We’re not the Royals who can only hope for the entire infrastructure of the game to change or for to have a sudden love for Kansas City, for their situation to look better.
WE ALL KNOW that the Mariners are an incredibly profitable franchise and could put themselves (with the right signings) back in the mix. We can sit around and wait for our young guys to possibly improve (a lot of people on here are putting a little too much stock in this I’m afraid) or we can go out and get a few good players. The final problem though is that it doesn’t end there, we have to spend our money wisely.
So when the FO says we have a limted amount to spend, even though we know they are making a ton of cash, (not to mention the additional revenue sources of the Nationals and the XM radio deals etc.) and then with that limited amount they go out and sign Dino-Bigot-Child Neglectin’ Carl this really makes my blood boil. Why? Because Guardado, Moyer, Johjima and Carl have just eaten a big chunk of our lunch money.
Our off-season priorities were stated as ‘pitching, left-handed bat and catching’ in that order. When are we going to address the big void that stands on the mound? Millwood must get done.
On a positive note: Any news on the situation with Matsuzaka and Boras?
Such a strange signing when there are so many alternatives. It’s almost like they’re spending money just for the sake of spending money.
The real question I have is why sign him now? Why not give yourself maximum time & flexibility through the off-season? Was there actually somebody out there competing for Everett? I find that hard to believe.
By the way, I love it when people say “I’ll wait until the year is over before forming my opinion of the signing”. That’s fine, but it’s worthless!
That’s fine. Carl Everett may be a role model citizen from now on for all I care. Not the point in my book. He still can’t hit.
Smegalicious: how can anyone even deny that? Off the top of my head, what you really want is the Sports Illustrated 6-4-1998 issue, which goes into this at length.
Mariners
Just because Everett hit 23hrs last year in Chicago doesn’t mean spending 3 million on him is a good idea. Earlier today Jim Thomson posted a long list of minor league free agents and other teams’ spare parts who would probably hit as well as or better the Everett for about one tenth the money.
Scott Spezio played ‘well’ for Anaheim. He hit a game changing homer in the World Series. He was ‘clutch’. He just wasn’t very good and wasn’t worth the money that the Mariners threw at him.
THAT above all else is what we assert about Carl Everett. He isn’t worth the money. The baggage is just gravy.
And by the way David H, what Everett was convicted of wasn’t ‘ordinary everybody does it [child] neglect’ where you let your little horror watch Nick Jr while you play Halo. The courts removed his children from his custody because he let his wife abuse them physically.
Southpaw, I know you aren’t saying that, appreciate the clarification, though.
I am of the belief Burnitz or finding someone internally might not be such a bad thing. I heard some mention Rondell White, but I don’t think he’d translate well at Safeco (my opinion). I was never sold on Jacque Jones either.
This signing sucks, and we don’t have to love it, but it’s done now apparently
Here’s to hoping for the best (I have doubts though).
my post in 74 should be “any”body with something beyond…
The neglect definition in this case is “failure to protect your child from abuse.”
That aside, I’m hoping soomething positive will happen in the near future that will make us forget about this day.
Hey, let’s take the money we just threw at Everett, add in the five or six we’ve committed to Eddie and wonder how far that $8 or $9 million would have taken us toward signing Millwood.
In baseball terms Everett’s dough may be ‘chump change’, but a million dollars here and a million dollars there and pretty soon you’re talking about a lot of money.
Andren: Good post.
Note to front office and Billy Bavasi: Fine, you signed a guy NONE of us are convinced is worth what you paid NOW sign Millwood or do a deal for a starter without shooting a hole elsewhere. NO excuses for not ponying up the money for Millwood now (just don’t give him 5 years).
Is there any chance Everett could “fail” his physical a la Vizquel? Or did he already pass it?
If the Mariners indeed sign Carl Everett today. How soon can he be traded?
DMZ, I don’t know how they can deny it, but they are. They’re trying to put the ‘changed man’ spin on everything.
They’re also convinced he can still play a good LF.
HEADS. UP. ASSES.
is there any chance there is another MLB player named Carl Everett?
The Bavasi firing meter just went from 10% to 20%.
If Ichiro thought team chemistry was bad last year, just wait until next year. They’ll have exactly the same record, but with the added benefit of getting lots of cross-country flights with a guy like Everett.
I’m definitely considering other ways to spend my cash next year. Maybe I could take the wife and kids down to Anaheim. We could go to Disneyland, then catch an Angels game. Or perhaps a trip to the Bay Area for an As game, and then some wine tasting in Napa. I also have a great friend in Chicago. I could take the cash that I ordinarily spend on Ms tickets and go to Chicago for a weekend of baseball at Wrigley and Comiskey.
See, unlike the Ms, I spend money on items and activites are enjoyable and productive. I expect everyone else on this blog does the same. Signing Everett is the equivalent of me spending money on . . . Actually, I can’t think of a real world parallel of an item that I could buy that would make next year unsuccessful for my family. Maybe the parallel is spending money on a noxious weed for the garden, or acquiring a taste for crack cocaine.
The Ms just spent $3 million to make the team worse, and in the process piss off their core base of fans. I’d rather see that cash stay in Lincoln’s pocket, or simply given to Felix as a down payment on future millions to come.
At this rate, the Ms are gonna need that $3 million as part of cash giveaways to entice fans into the stands. Rather than paying Everett $18k for every game he plays, they could simply give away that cash every night in order to get fans into the stands.
I guarantee the Ms would sell more tickets if they gave away that cash to the fans at every game rather than paying Everett to showcase his “skills” next year.
That would assume that he was EVER able to play a good LF. Something I highly doubt considering his grand total of 120 games there.
Any record of how God-bothering, queer-bating Carl got along with his animal-sacrificing idolatrous manager, Ozzie Guillen?
Memo to God:
Please stop hanging out with guys like Carl Everett. You are going to get a bad reputation.
Sincerely
Us Humans
I just called them back and quoted SI at them. The guy in charge of the Carl Everett complaints sounds like it’s been a loooong day.
C’mon, Mariner’s faithful, keep calling them and complaining. Maybe we can do some good!
(206) 346-4001
Welcome, Mr. Spiezio/Crillio of 2006.
This sucks. This sucks hard.
I think I would reather the M’s had announced that WFB would be the new DH/LF in place of crazy carl. Honestly, a platoon of … everybody else would be better.
Oh, I’ll still go to the games. I’ll just be taking my bathroom breaks during his at bats.
Wait…maybe this is a more subtle strategy than we realize. Bear with me:
Maybe the Mariners know they need someone for the fans to hate, someone to villify and pile our bad feelings on. Maybe they don’t want that kind of pressure on Beltre or anyone else on the team. What better scapegoat than Carl ‘the only thing I can hit anymore is my kid’ Everett? This could just be a brilliant move, right? Right guys??? Please…
When the people who comment on a Mariners blog in December are this frustrated, that’s not a good sign. Lose the diehards and who is left?
Sorry if this has been discussed, but is there any chance that Everett will primarily fill a bench + backup 1B + DH vs. Lefties role? If we end up signing or trading for a real LF and platooning Ibanez and Everett at DH, then at least the signing might help the team. Our bench sucked hard last year and having a veteran bat on it can only help.
That said, couldn’t the FO have found someone without all the baggage who could fill that role just as well? Signing a name player isn’t all that helpful if the name carries connotations like “kook,” “loose cannon,” and “child abuser.”
Sheesh.
Maybe the Ms can add a new, Children of Everett, program to the Mariners Care program: Every homerun will generate cash to prevent child abuse and diverity programs.
Everyone will think it is a special program for the children of the City of Everett, until they read the fine print.
http://seattle.mariners.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/sea/community/index.jsp
Looking at the current roster, there really isn’t a good candidate for the third annual mid-season high-profile DFA, to show that we’re “committed to winning/rebuilding/whatever”. Based on the analyses presented of Everett’s declining performance, I think he’s the odds-on favorite now! (Pitchers excluded!)
The decision to sign, or not sign Everett, is irrelevant when examining the future success of team.
The current roster, w/ or w/o Everett, will not contend this year.
The bat we need is NOT out there! Everett is a band-aid fix b/c we don’t have, or cannot easily acquire, another guy that can step in and fill the role at any lower of a price-tag. Jacque Jones is too expensive and Burnitz would command the same dough, but w/less bat. Who else is there? Definitely no one from inside the org.
I also highly doubt that the $3 million spent in Everett’s 1-yr contract would make any material difference in signing Millwood or any of the other coveted and overvalued free agents out there. They’re looking for 3-4 year contracts — $1 mil a year towards one of these contracts is negligible. If the M’s are going to overpay for Millwood, this million won’t make the difference.
I’m sure the M’s front office is hoping for the best w/Everett, but at the same time, it doesn’t matter…we’ll see another lackluster M’s season and Everett will not be picked up for 2007. He’s a band-aid, a thumb in the dyke, so to speak…just enough of a solution to get to the free agent fiasco that will be happening next year at this time.
The M’s need Millwood or a big trade to at least provide a shred of realistic hope for ‘06. Its not too late.
Everett w/ the M’s? Who cares?
They traded Guillen because of ’social’ issues. This deal makes it very easy to not re-up for 06. Were not getting better, just more interesting.
I feel the need to once again haul out the object lesson for why HRs and RBI are not good measures of performance – even past performance.
2004. Tony Batista.
32 HR. 110 RBI.
.241/.272/.455
EqA: .242 – rough 2005 equivalent: Willie Bloomquist
MLV: -8.3 – rough 2005 equivalent: Bret Boone
So, by signing Carl Everett, the M’s are saying that they’re willing to give $3 million to someone with his baseball skills to be their DH. Players who were in 2005 roughly as valuable as him on a per plate appearance basis?
Doug Mientkiewicz
Greg Zaun
Do you want either of them as your DH for $3 million?
# 81 – Colm,
I was worried that would happen, but I didn’t want to dampen what I thought was already obvious sarcasm with a disclaimer. But here you go: child neglect is awful, and when that neglect is actually physical abuse (which somehow gets dropped in between the charge and the conviction), it is even worse. I can’t imagine why he is still allowed his re-instated custody of his son custody after failing to continue his counseling. I am depressed that the Mariners are giving Carl Everett the right to wear a Mariners uniform in front of the fans at Safeco Field, and are paying him handsomely to do so. I told them that in an email that I’m sure will go all the way to the top (disclaimer: sarcasm, again).
In other news, on the Dinosaur/homosexuality note, apparently Carl’s literal textual interpretation doesn’t include:
“Six days my work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the Lord: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.”
I suppose we could recoup most of the $3 million if he is put to death after playing against Oakland 4/09. A boy can dream, right?
Though not a good signing, this isn’t affecting how many games I go to next year. Which is more interesting to watch: a bland, faceless 75-win team, or a 75-win team with one guy that could have a meltdown at any moment?
It’s official:
[snip long, long link]
Here’s two gem quotes:
“Today we achieved one of our off-season goals,” Bavasi said. “Carl Everett is a clutch-hitting run producer with power. As a switch-hitter, he provides our lineup with added versatility. Carl is a winner, most recently as a member of the 2005 World Series Champion Chicago White Sox. His experience and intensity will be welcome additions to our clubhouse.”
and:
“Carl will primarily be the DH, but will also play some in our outfield,” Mariners Manager Mike Hargrove said. “Having him in my lineup gives us some of the left-handed sock and run production we were looking for.”
HOORAY FOR LEFT HANDED SOCK!
Hopefully he goes on the DL with a dinosaur bite and we never have to see him.
I don’t want Carl Everett going anywhere NEAR King Felix. Not in the clubhouse, not on the plane, not in the bar after the game. No, seriously…
98 – According to Howard Lincoln, the “die hard” fans only represent 5% (1 in 20) of the ticket-paying customer base. So maybe he’s hoping the casual fan will not notice or not care enough about the signing, so long as they have Willie, Ichi, and the Safe to go see (sung to the tune of “Willie, Mickey and the Duke”).
Why does John Rocker get suspended for making the same comments as Everett?
I’ve disliked Everett since he decided that the batter’s box didn’t apply to him and dared the umps to call him on it. He practically stands on top of the plate.
The guy is a certified nut job and he can’t hit. He’ll be DFA’d by July 8th…my only hope is that he’ll take Bavasi down with him.
“clutch hitting”
“proven winner”
wow, anyone else think of someone who might have had some clutch hits for a WS winning team? Perhaps in 2002? That worked out great huh?
#111: His placement in the batters box is what I like about him most. I like the idea of having an aggressive lefty hitting in SAFECO…and when I say aggressive, yeah, I mean it.
#110-Judging from the reaction here, Howard better hope that diehards don’t make up more than 1 in 20. We’re 110+ comments in and the best anything that’s been said about signing Crazy Carl is that it might not be a complete disaster.
Will the M’s let me into Safeco if I have a sign that says “Carl, the dinosaurs don’t believe in you, either!”?
That’s pretty funny, Southpaw. Everett’s signing follows exactly the same M.O. as Spiezio’s signing.
So… How long before Everett starts a game with a batting average of .054?
#70:
If you want to quote me, please be accurate.
Hey, everybody makes mistakes. You pay for it, and you move on – right?
There will be plenty of time to bash the guy if he does not produce, or comes up with new John Rocker – like incidents.
Besides, if he’s around a bunch of good guys, maybe some of it will rub off on him.
One can only hope…
Gay-bashing, child-beating, intellectually-ignorant, crude, disruptive creep. Oh yeah, average (barely) hitter, terrible fielder. I feel like Bavasi just left a lump of coal in my stocking and I need to vent!
David H.
Sorry I missed the sarasm. We Europeans just don’t understand irony as well as you Americans.
The press release is now on mlb.com:
[long long link snipped]
Among other good quotes: “Carl will primarily be the DH, but will also play some in our outfield,” Mariners Manager Mike Hargrove said.
“His experience and intensity will be welcome additions to our clubhouse.”
We owe it to Bill Bavasi, for his own good, to remind him of this quote ad nauseum by season’s end.
M’s Zn
“I highly doubt that the $3M in Everett’s contract would make any difference”
You honestly don’t think a million dollars a year is going to get anybody’s attention?
When the M’s offer player X $33M over 3 years and the Orioles trump us by offering $36M will you still stand by that comment? It’s not like stupid shit like that hasn’t happened before.
The FO carelessly spent a little ‘chump change’ on the likes of Spezio and missed out on a real target like Tejada.
Relating this topic with the Beane/Bradley topic:
Beane places a very high value on getting on base. After years it has become apparent that the Mariners do no value this skill enough. Now we get an angry hacker who isn’t good at getting on base, and is declining in that skill set.
Say hello to the bottom of the league in runs scored…
SoDo MoFo!!!!!
So, can we all agree that for the first USSMariner Safeco trip of 2006, everybody goes dressed as purple dinosaurs?
People used to pay just to see Lou throw a huge temper tantrum and toss a few bases around. Perhaps they are hoping to rekindle those “glory days” (those with “exciting” 73 win teams) by signing Crazy Carl.
Remember when the Mariner Moose use to throw water at the bullpen and they did the same back to him? Can’t wait to see what the Moose does to Carl. Fireworks extroadinare.
I wonder how many people would have rather the M’s signed Julio Frano (47) to a two year contract for slightly less money.
We should form the gay paleontologists’ club and get them to announce us on the scoreboard.
For the record, I sent the M’s a nasty e-mail, too. I detailed for them Everett’s misdeeds, not because I didn’t think they already knew, but so that they’d know that the fans do, too.
I also told them that fans are already calling him the SoDo MoFo. That should scare them.
If BB really believes that this move achieves one of his goals, then our misery will not end until there is a FO house cleaning. Man, what a disappointing day.
I can’t worked up about this either way. I’m sad to say that Ms apathy is wearing me down to the point that I just don’t care.
If he performs to his projections, I’ll again be finding other things to do other then watch a ballgame or even listen to the radio.
Signed,
Eyeore
Looking on the bright side, Everett wasn’t offered arbitration, so like Johjima he won’t cost us a draft pick, which Bavasi apparently values more than Gillick. And if he came cheaper than the other options, maybe it’s a decision to save money for a run at Millwood. Straining for excuses, I know.
Johjima costs us a draft pick? Who gets it???
My personal all-time favorite freshly-minted World Series Champion to be added to the M’s roster who ended up producing Jack Squat, is Pokey Reese. How can you forget that “proven winner”? His only contribution to the team was that idiotic TV commercial where he slides into base during the “Long Ball” discussion.
We were 13th in the AL in runs scored last season. We were 14th in On Base %. Signing a player with an unadjusted OBP lower than our team average OBP is not going to improve our offense.
This is just ridiculous.
I agree with above suggestion – emailing the Mariners WAS very good for my soul. I try really hard not to cuss in front of my children.
Well, I called the season ticket office prior to the signing to tell them i thought it was a bad idea. I guess I’ll call them again to say:
“I’ve already renewed my subscription for this year, but I won’t be taking my son to any games where Carl Everett is on the roster. I may just toss the tickets in the trash can. If he’s still on the roster at the end of the year, I won’t be renewing for ‘07″
If you see emtpy seats in Sec 119 Row 3, you’ll know why.
Johjima does not cost us a draft pick.
I wonder if they could get Moyer to pitch BP to him, so that he could get another chance to drill him?
102, I completely disagree with your post.
The decision to sign, or not sign Everett, is irrelevant when examining the future success of team.
Then why sign him in the first place? Every dollar spent, every player in uniform should and does contribute to further growth or lack thereof for this team. It contributes to budget decisions, fanbase, on-field decion-making…you name it.
The current roster, w/ or w/o Everett, will not contend this year.
Most would agree, although some might say we have a chance provided a few variables sort themselves out. He sure doesn’t help us financially go after the final pitching puzzle pieces either.
The bat we need is NOT out there! Everett is a band-aid fix b/c we don’t have, or cannot easily acquire, another guy that can step in and fill the role at any lower of a price-tag. Jacque Jones is too expensive and Burnitz would command the same dough, but w/less bat. Who else is there? Definitely no one from inside the org.
Actually there are/were several players that have been listed here as alternatives. Thanks for mentioning Jeromy Burnitz who is not a clubhouse cancer and can actually play some defense, which in turn, helps our squad.
I also highly doubt that the $3 million spent in Everett’s 1-yr contract would make any material difference in signing Millwood or any of the other coveted and overvalued free agents out there. They’re looking for 3-4 year contracts — $1 mil a year towards one of these contracts is negligible. If the M’s are going to overpay for Millwood, this million won’t make the difference.
What? So if we supposedly have a budget surplus of $20M to spend and we just burnt 15% of that then it doesn’t make any difference? I don’t see your logic.
I’m sure the M’s front office is hoping for the best w/Everett, but at the same time, it doesn’t matter…we’ll see another lackluster M’s season and Everett will not be picked up for 2007. He’s a band-aid, a thumb in the dyke, so to speak…just enough of a solution to get to the free agent fiasco that will be happening next year at this time.
I semi-agree with you here but for different reasons altogether. There’s a good chance that we will see another lackluster season this year BECAUSE OF not IN SPITE OF the Everett signing. There’s also a chance Bavasi won’t make it to the ‘free agent fiasco’ next year with this signing.
Everett w/ the M’s? Who cares?
I think a few people here do….
I will say that the Johjima, Moyer and Torrealba work makes sense. The Guardado and Everett contracts don’t look too clear to me. I had hoped that they had signed Guardado and would then eventually trade him. It’s not looking like that is going to happen. Millwood would paint a rosy picture on this whole scene.
And just this moment, arriving in my e-mail inbox from the Ms, this message (hey, if Jerry Reinsdorf says he’s a good guy…./sarcasm):
“From the Desk of Chuck Armstrong
Dear Mariners Season Ticket Holders,
First off and most importantly, Happy Holidays! I hope that this e-mail finds you and your family enjoying the start of this beautiful Northwest winter.
I wanted to take a moment to address you, our most valued fans, regarding today’s signing of Carl Everett.
We believe Carl will be an asset to the Mariners both on and off the field. As a switch-hitter, he will provide our lineup with versatility and the left-handed run production we need. He was a key contributor to the Chicago White Sox Championship season this year, hitting .300 in the post-season.
We are aware of the issues that Carl had in the past, but are confident that he has dealt with them and has moved on. As with every player we sign, Bill Bavasi and his staff have done their research. After speaking with numerous people throughout the baseball world, and spending time with Carl at the Winter Meetings, they are convinced he is a good fit for our club right now.
Ozzie Guillen and Kenny Williams, the White Sox Manager and General Manager, both have told Bill they believe Carl will be an asset to our team. And White Sox owner Jerry Reinsdorf personally assured me that Carl is a good man who can be a positive force for our club. Mike Hargrove plans to use him as DH as well as in the outfield from time to time. We believe Carl’s intensity, enthusiasm and competitive spirit will be welcome additions to our team both on the field and in the clubhouse.
I know you will join with me in welcoming Carl as the newest member of the Mariners family.
Our goal is — and always has been — to win baseball games. We have a good foundation in place with exciting young players like Felix Hernandez, Yuniesky Betancourt and Jose Lopez, and experienced veterans like Jamie Moyer, Richie Sexson, Adrian Beltre and Raul Ibañez. We still have work to do, but our goal is to become a championship caliber team as quickly as possible.
Once again, thank you for being, without a doubt, the best fans in baseball. May your holiday season be filled with the joys of giving in the company of family and friends. I look forward to seeing you at Safeco Field on the afternoon of April 3rd.
Warm Regards,
Chuck Armstrong
President and COO
Seattle Mariners
“
I think I will resist the invitation of the Mariners’ email announcement to “customize [my] own Everett jersey”.
#88: If the Mariners indeed sign Carl Everett today. How soon can he be traded?
I’m not sure if you’re serious or just expressing frustration.
The CBA says that newly-signed free agents can’t be traded before May 15 without their consent. Cold reality says that the M’s won’t find a bona fide trading partner for Carl Everett before hell freezes over.
No mention of Reed…hmm.
Maybe he’ll knock over a few card tables in the clubhouse.
My favorite Carl Evertt story, from his years with the Boston Red Sox: Earlier that season, [Manny Ramirez] left a surprise birthday cake at Carl Everett’s locker. One problem — Ramirez mistakenly ordered the cake labeled, “Happy 29th,” when it was in fact Everett’s 30th birthday. The combustible Everett, incensed at being made the butt of a joke, slammed the cake in the nearest trash can while a crestfallen Ramirez wondered what he had done wrong.
http://www.eagletribune.com/news/stories/20040530/SP_001.htm
Anyone wanna go in on a cake to deliver to the M’s locker room on June 3?
no mention of ichiro either, so i wouldn’t put all that much stock in reed’s absence…
seriously, i’m swallowing as hard as i can, but it still keeps coming back up.
I was being dead serious. I hope they trade him.
If the White Sox thought Carl was such an asset why did they not even bother to offer him arb, much less a contract?
And again Chuckie, what about the fact that he’s, you know, NOT A VERY GOOD HITTER?????????
This signing does not affect the pursuit of Millwood one bit.
If the M’s want to meet Boras’ demands, the payroll is there.
That story makes me feel bad for Manny. Poor Manny.
Maybe, they’re trying to emphasize the team name and get back to the nautical roots. This offseason has been quite similar to some famous ships. You know, started with grand ideas (Burnett + lefty sock + improved bench + Matsuzaka), got off to a decent start (Johjima, Moyer, Carvajal), and then came to a crashing halt (Everett, the soon to be signed Scott Elarton).
Mmmmm yummy. The Seattle Titanics.
sigh. three callers to KJR. one thinks he’ll give them ‘edge’ & can’t recall the last time they had a guy like that, one wants production & a player who might say something, esp. now that Boone is gone, and one only wants production because what Beltre did last year was ‘a joke’
ok, so in the snippet of the press conference just airing, Bill feels Carl is not afraid to compete hard, they had their choice of players, and that Chuck & Bill gave Mike the choice of some names at the winter meeting, and Mike immediately went for Carl.
I can’t wait to see how Rick Rizzs will try to sugarcoat Carl for an entire season. I imagine he’ll mention “member of the world champion Chicago White Sox” every time Jurassic steps to the plate. He’ll also mention how Carl is a switch hitter, which will allow Ricky to segueway into some “baseball analysis” about how that gives Hargrove all sorts of lineup options. Yes!
I’ve never felt so discouraged
#137– so, was there any way to e-mail Chuck back to thank him for his warm wishes?
-142 “Anyone wanna go in on a cake to deliver to the M’s locker room on June 3? ”
No, but how about a cow pie?
Shorter version of Carl Everett’s press conference
“I’m not afraid to tell people if they aren’t competing.”
“I believe that anything goes on the field.”
“I’m going to push this team over the edge.”
That last part isn’t a direct quote, but a close paraphrase.
Signing Everett is the very definition of high risk, low reward.
[sorry, you don't get to tell your fellow readers to do that]
so, I didn’t watch a lot of Carl this last year. does he still stand right in the middle of the plate during at-bats?
I’, curious….ive been looking all evening…where is the character metric?
On a per at-bat basis, Everett and Beltre were about equal last year.
#154. mentioning the fact that he lost custody of a child is not “just repeating someone else’s opinions or verbiage”…
Everett is the wrong solution to the right idea. Seattle needs a one year DH/LF to hold a spot until Snelling can make it back (according to D-O-V, he is reportedly ahead of schedule). I was personally hoping for Durazo, but Everett is not a huge step down.
Also, I’m not sure I would call Ibanez a bad fielder. I have seen ratings scouting reports that have had him average to even slightly above average in LF. He’s no Randy Winn, but then again, Randy Winn is gone.
If Everett blows up and make a scene, he will be cut and replaced by Morse or Snelling. Its basically a 4-5 million dollar experiment. So for one more year we will lack an impact #3 hitter. Man, do we need Beltre to step up or what?
This deal also means the M’s will have plenty of money to throw at Millwood. Considering that next offseason’s crop is only a little better than this one’s, Bavasi should consider giving Boras a 5th year for Millwood; even though Millwood’s results have been up and down. Whatever it takes.
I just read what Everett has said about homosexuals in the past. You can hear that on any given Sunday-in church. Im not sure why some are focusing on those comments.
I will not attend any games until Everett AND Bavasi are gone.
msb-
I apologize that I did not write that part down too, that is fact. I am not trying to argue with you, whats the point. But let me ask you this.. Who cares? Does that affect his play. His stats show he is mediocre or average but does neglecting his child make him hit lefties better than righties? Is Carls part time job to be a good role model for your kids or to baby sit them for you. So he messed up. I have messed up. I am sure you have messed up. Give him a clean slate! Thats it, boo him if does horrible this season, but do it then.
Here’s the thing: if you believe in players as role models, a nice clean team, etc., I can understand that, and you should be ticked.
If you don’t, he’s still a bad player who isn’t going to help the team.
w/r/t comments on gays: whether or not you agree with Everett, or whether the same kind of thing is spoken at some pulpits, it’s personally offensive to a significant part of the fan base. Why do that?
This signing does affect the potential signing of Millwood…..its makes signing Millwood more likely…serious money wasnt committed to a guy like Jones.
Well, there is little point in arguing now. The deal is done. We’ll see if Everett performs. Certainly Bavasi’s signings of bench players seem to have established a pattern: bad.
If Everett hit like David Ortiz, I would be the first to overlook his past comments. I’m not particularly proud of that, but there it is.
What is upsetting about this signing is that it is simply a massive, massive risk. And there is precious little in Everett’s recent performances to indicate the risk will pay off.
DMZ
I agree with you for the most part, thank you for that- I think we should just wait until the season to say he isn’t going to help, maybe just delaying the inevitable, but still no one knows what will happen.
E-mailed the M’s.
Told them that I’m glad I don’t have to explain this. Especially to Mr.(Beloved by Seattle; pays for Tiny Tim’s operations)Moyer.
Wasn’t at the game but remember Rizz’s call…”Check out that guys act! Absolutely no class!” Can’t wait for a ‘junior sportscaster’ to ask “Hey Rick, didn’t Carl grab his unit and make obscene gestures, and then you told us he has no class? So, whats up with that ‘Meet the Mariners’ fluff piece yesterday?”
The e-mail made me feel a bit better. After all, we buy their product, and have a right to complain. A ‘New Coke’ result may be too much to hope for. (Whoops! In the immortal words of Rod Stewart: “Look how wrong you can be!”)
Maybe none of us know him, but all of us can spell ‘none’
#163, They stuck a microphone in his face and asked him to express his religious views?
I just can’t see everyones big deal with this. I know he’s a terrible person, and a not so great player, BUT it’s for 1 friggin year!!!!!!! I bet their decision making was that no-one else was available they’d want for more than 1 year (no, not even Jacque Jones), because they want to look for a REAL solution to the whole LF-DH bit. I don’t totally agree with that reasoning, seeings how Ibanez could be gone after next year, BUT it’s not going to kill the team.
Griffin,
He probably will, and we probably will.
We’re annoyed now, because having the opportunity to boo Everett is costing the M’s $3M that they’d be better spending elsewhere.
#166
Every single number is going AGAINST Everett having any sort of rebound, at all. It’s been covered many times on this site, age, park factor, team quality, etc. Every metric shows that he is going to be an awful player; the fact that he’s had numerous outbursts are just filler in the nutty fruitcake.
#152– you can also add Carl’s immortal quote from Maxim that he might be crazy, but he is “fun crazy”
Everett is going to be on KJR in the next minute or so….
[Rizzs has an s]
I just got that mail too. The first question that popped into my head is, if Ozzie and Kenny both though Carl would be such an asset, why didn’t they re-sign him?
The board has hashed out the baseball value questions, and I think everyone has their side of the fence on whether Everett will help the team win or not. As far as the “character” issues go, the way I see it is, I follow the team so I can root for them to win. It’s fun to go to playoff games, i’d like to go to them again. It’s not fun to root for louts. If there’s a lout in the lineup, he better make playoff games a hell of a lot more likely to make a net positive contribution to the fun. Everett may be a changed man as Armstrong claims, but he hasn’t done anything to publically demonstrate that he’s no longer a lout. No apologies for stupid or misconstrued statements, no indication he’s improved his parenting skills, nada.
I’ve always liked the fire that Everett brings to the clubhouse, and, hopefully, to the field. I’d rather have Carl Everett than some of our former “saviors” like Spiezio, Cirillo, or Aurillia. Of course, If Carl turns out to be a flop like the aforementioned three, then Bavasi’s score card in the “free agent bat” department will be the laughingstock of baseball.
Big Terry – Read the rest of what I wrote- Thats not my arguement. I hit that on my next comment. Who cares what his religous views are. Are all mariner fans christian? does carls views have to match with yours? Who cares if he believes in what he believes? Whats that have to do with his performance. Find something else to complain about.
it’s no wonder this team hasn’t won a world series and never will… because then fans of this team just want nice guys instead of people with an edge and has won almost everywhere he’s went. and who also had more homers and RBI’s than raul ibanez who you all praise here… you all are more interested in nice guys than you are winning… IMO.
“nice guys finish last”
#176– of course, Aurillia & Spiezio were brought in spec. because they supposedly had that same on-field fire and grit…
Kelly,
I’m in.
Do they announce the kids in advance…
I’m thinking bribery.
178, seatown:
You need to learn to read. We don’t want nice guys who can’t play or bad guys who can’t play, we want guys that can play. A guy who can’t help the team is bad enough. A guy who is a terrible guy who can’t help the team is worse.
you all are more interested in nice guys than you are winning
Welcome, new or recently joined reader! I hope that in time, you’ll understand that your statements don’t really apply to the crowd here.
In the meantime, that’s some “edge” Carl has.
If people don’t like the signing because they think he stinks, that’s one thing (and I would agree with them). But if you don’t like it because of “role model issues”, I think that’s absurd. There are far more important things to get upset about.
Anybody who has spent any amount of time around a professional sports team knows that the majority of these players are anything but role models. Whether you want to believe it or not, most of your supposed role models in sports are as flawed as general society.
Charles Barkley was right: athletes are not role models. End of story. Not Carl Everett, not Alex Rodriguez, not Ken Griffey Jr., not any of them. I take my kids to the ball park to watch a baseball game not to educate them as to how to live their lives. There are a lot of companies that all of us buy goods and services from that have employees who have done things a lot worse than Carl Everett. If you want “role models” look elsewhere. Tell your kids that teachers, people who donate their time to help the poor and hungry, civil servants who risk their lives to protect and serve…those are role models. Baseball players are paid money to hit and catch a ball…. they are entertainment, nothing more.
Hey Seatown
Are you being ironic too? Because if you are it isn’t clear.
If not: Your grammar is shaky and your grasp of logic even worse.
MattinPeoria
You’re right. I shouldn’t go to M’s games to look for rolemodels. I should go to look for highly skilled baseball players.
And that description doesn’t apply to Carl Everett either.
It’s not absurd.
At some point, if you’re a fan of a team, there’s a point you draw and say “I don’t think winning is worth X”. For many people, I’d agree with you, that line’s drawn way too close to “choir boy”.
But it’s all a matter of standards. Mine happens to be drawn to one side of Carl Everett.
I have to disagree with DMZ’s post.
First off, as a group USSM has chided the Mariner’s management for preferring popular players over good players. Sign Carl Everett, and what’s the complain? He’s not fan friendly.
The counter argument might be, Everett’s not any good…
Everett OPS’d 746 last year, while Player X OPSd 716.
Everett has a career OPS of 813. Player X career OPS is 782.
Everett has 4 seasons of +800 OPS, Player X, 2 seasons of +800 OPS.
To put it frankly… there is no reason to expect that Carl Everett will be outperformed by Adrian Beltre.
I’ve been reading this blog since it’s earliest days… but I feel like real sabrmetrics and statistical analysis are no longer part of the purpose…
Uh, Manzell, to put it frankly, you must be joking….considering the age differences and park differences, comparing Everett to Beltre.
I worry that any sort of e-mail, letter-writing, or phone call campaign will only result in re-inforcing the view of the M’s front office that “chemistry” should play a very significant role in player evaluation. This contributed to decisions such as replacing Carlos Guillen with Rich Aurilia and significantly overpaying Dan Wilson through his precipitious decline.
This signing is not a good one — but it’s not that bad either. Let’s not forget we are talking about a one-year commitment for $3 million. That’s $2.7 million in marginal cost for what likely results in 1 or 2 marginal wins above a replacement player. We are paying $1.3-$2.7 million per marginal win in all likelihood, though the potential for it to be worse is there also. This does not kill us like signing Matt Morris for $24M over three years would have.
Carl Everett is not very good and this is not a great signing. But I implore people to save their political capital as fans for a bad signing that does not involve a player with “character issues.” The result is that you’re going to send a message to the FO that will result in us not pursuing players like Milton Bradley or Manny Ramirez because of the same “character issues.” Then the message boards will fill up with complaints about how the M’s care more about having a team of nice guys than winning because they did not pursue players like Bradley or Ramirez. So, please, wait for a bad signing that indistinguishably involves overpaying for bad talent if you are going to complain to the Mariners.
Disclaimer: If you truly and consistently believe that character and clubhouse chemistry are important in building a ballclub, then go right ahead and bombard the Mariners with complaints. Holding that opinion is your right and I encourage you to express it fully. I am only trying to persuade people who are angry about this signing due the player’s abilities (or lack thereof) to wait for a better opportunity to express their displeasure to the Mariners as it might send the wrong message.
Rooting for bad people causes psychic pain.
Losing games causes psychic pain.
Doing both causes twice the pain.
#187 – there are many fallacies in your logic. First off, I think people on here (in general) dislike the Everett signing for the lack of bang for the buck as much as the bad attitude.
Also, was there any park adjustments made for those Everett-Beltre comparisons? Everett has hit in far friendlier parks in his career than Beltre. Also, Beltre is 26 or 27 and Everett is 34, so comparing “X amount of years performing at whatever OPS” is not really an apples-to-apples comparison either. If you’re going to try and hype up Everett as being comparable to Beltre, you should really use the same standards to compare each player.
Like I said earlier, if Everett hit the ball like David Ortiz my opinion of this signing would be different. But as it stands Everett’s skill on the field is declining and his reputation is far from pristine.
The signing is just a huge risk. The odds that he hits 23 HRs next year are small. He hit 15 HR last year in Comiskey, while batting .217 in 235 AB. I suspect he’ll find Safeco quite spacious.
Best of luck to Everett and the Ms next year. I really hope Everett hits 30 dingers. I won’t bet on it, but maybe it will happen.
On the bright side, if signing Everett means we see less of Bloomie in the OF – GREAT. Not sure what I’ll do if I pay $30 to go see Everett in left, and Bloomie in center on Reed’s day off. (shudder)
I agree with Derek on this one. There are limits. In professional sports one tends to draw them very broadly, but some behaviour is too egregious to be forgiven. How we define that behaviour will vary from person to person.
The dinosaur lunacy is just an extreme version of the biblical literalism that is quite common in the US. It doesn’t bother me too much.
Being an asshole to fans, umpires and many fellow players – that’s not a disqualifier either.
The anti-gay thing is pretty unenlightened, and I find it obnoxious, but as expressed in the Maxim article is actually less offensive than what a lot of mainstream politicians in this country were saying in the last election campaign.
Beating your children into submission with belts – which Everett once tolerated and has never publicly renounced – I find that hard to forgive.
Playing DH and hitting like a second baseman – that’s the clincher here.
Hey Manzell, Adrian Beltre plays very good defense at an important and difficult position. Carl Everett is so bad in the outfield Ozzie Guillen only saw fit to play him 177 innings in the OF all of last year. 397 of his 490 AB’s came while DH’ing. So please do not compare the SoDo MoFo to Adrian Beltre.
The main problem people have is that this doesn’t make sense baseball-wise. The personal psychosis stuff is just icing on the cake. Why don’t people get that?
Just an observation but most people on these forums want deals to get done want players to come in… When there was a rumor of Manny coming to Seattle a lot of people were saying NO, no no… Rumor of Miguel Tejada coming people once again not wanting… Theres 2 stars that even if they came there would of been unhappy people… I just really think most of the people here are being to hard to please… Look at the free agents this year and show me a guy that would be just as good as Carl Everett that we could of got for 1 year?
#178–”has won almost everywhere he’s went.”
well, sort of. he’s played 13 seasons, 7 times on losing teams, 8 times on teams above .500 (usually just above .500) He went to the division series with the Astros (where they lost), & then last year won the whole thing with the Sox.
my problem is the hypocrisy inherent in Carl Everett standing under the “Refuse to abuse” sign in a Mariners uniform.
Re: #110, #114 –
Howard Lincoln may well say that hard-core fans make up only 5% of the fanbase, but what is baffling about this signing is that it alienates both this 5% of hardcore nuts (myself included), as WELL as the 95% of the fans that are of the ‘casual’ variety, the very fans that, at least in the minds of folks on this board, are responsible for the everlasting presence on the MLB roster of Willie Bloomquist and Dan Wilson, long after his utility had expired. The hardcore fan looks at Everett and says, ‘mediocre player at best, smack dab in the midst of his decline phase.’ The casual fan says, ‘Hey, isn’t that the guy who spit at Jamie Moyer a couple of years ago? Why is he on OUR team?’
Yeah, it’s a one-year deal, not gonna break the bank, etc. But man, CARL EVERETT??!??!! Ugh.
So much of what I’ve wanted to say has already been said. So I’ll leave you with this future feature on the Diamondvision:
ANNOUNCER: And now it’s time for Ask The Mariners!
FAN: I want to ask the Mariners what their nickname was when they were kids.
BLOOMQUIST: Uh, um. “Scrappy.”
IBANEZ: The kids called me “Kojak.”
EVERETT: (pause) I ain’t doing this b******t. What kind of f**king b******t question is that? Stupid a**hole fan. (walks away) GET THE F**K OUT OF MY WAY YOU F**KING CAMERAMAN! (sound of belt whipping a cameraman)
Mariners
Jim Thomson compiled a list of possibilites earlier today. Most of these are unwanted spare parts on other teams and minor league free agents rather than ‘name’ players like Everett or Burnitz. Most could easily perform as well. None would cost as much. It’s not that short a list.
http://ussmariner.com/?p=3185#comments
I’ve always thought that an analogy to playing blackjack was apt in rating many baseball transactions.
If you have 17 and the dealer shows a 10, you’re stupid to take a hit. Yes, some of the time you’ll get a 3 or a 4. You’re still stupid and it was a dumb move because it goes horribly against the percentages.
Signing Everett is hitting 17 against the dealer’s 10. The Mariners might get really lucky and get a 3. It was still a dumb move even if they get lucky and it does pan out.
Well, it’s been fun being a Mariner fan. I guess my hope now is that I can be a Mariner fan again when Everett’s contract runs out in spring of 2007. See you guys on the other side, hopefully…
BTW Mariners
‘would HAVE been unhappy’ not ‘would OF been unhappy’
I know I’m being a prick about it, but it’s a pet peeve of mine. ‘Of’ makes no sense in your context.
196: If you recall, several of those posts revolved around a hypothetical straight up trade between player X and player Y, the gist being why pay a ton of money for people who are statistically likely to decline when we have dirt cheap options that aren’t as good but a lot more cost effective. With the Everett signing, its like we took a player who’s declined, skipped the good to okay years and went straight to the craptacular when there were better options out there.
Many people here disapprove of the M’s for bringing in and sticking with mediocre players because they are “family friendly”, nice local guys, and have the dreaded “intangibles”. It’s fine if you don’t like Everett as a player but who gives a damn if he is an a-ho?
Some of us do. I know we’re being picky, and perhaps inconsistent, but there are limits. See above.
See also – who was that punk college pitcher who tried to decapitate an opponent in the on deck circle? Ben Christiansen? Yeah, him too.
Locke (stunning Gastineau during the KJR cross-talk) just ran through a Locke-ish Litany of why Everett is a bad signing numerically & defensively… of course, he was following up his pet theory which is that the Ms need to trade Beltre & Sexson (a la the Marlins) especially as (in his view) there is nothing in their farm system– why, they couldn’t even get Pat Gillick who built their franchise interested in a trade (sez David)
Did anyone hear in the press confrence when Bavasi said that he offered a bunch of players to Hargrove and Hargrove chose Everett?
Do we have room on the 40 man roster for CE or does someone else get bumped by this signing…
I am in complete and total agreement with DMZ, everything he’s said on this issue, and want to compliment him on the excellent way he’s expressed those views.
As said above, there is a limit to what kind of behavior, what kind of person, I will support – in ANY business or company that I spend good money on. And yeah, I’m on that same side of the line as DMZ and others are with regard to Carl Everett on my team. Wearing MY uniform, walking onto MY beautiful field. It is nauseating.
Here’s something I just thought of that made it worse. Carl Everett at DH is now the (yes, I know it’s one year only but…) successor to Edgar Martinez. Could you possibly find two individuals who have less in common?
I’m thinking I’ve always wanted to be able to take in more Rainiers games than I have, but the Ms addiction has been hard to break. It’s almost like Chuck and Howard have performed an intervention, for I feel the addiction waning and the possibility of upgrading from a flex plan to a full season plan in Tacoma sounds quite appealing.
Tom, Mariners, Seatown, etc
If you can’t see the compatibility of 1) wanting the Mariners to value talent over family-frienliness and nearness of birthplace to safeco, and 2) not wanting the team to sign players who abuse their kids or viciously thow a baseball at a kid in the on-deck circle ending his career, then there isn’t much point to argue this further.
There is a valid debate over where to draw the line, there is a valid debate over whether Everett can still play (though the evidence is fairly convincing), and there is a valid debate over whether the money could have been better spent, but when your argument is that 1 and 2 above are mutually exclusive and anyone who asserts both is a hypocrite, you are missing the debate.
I just got home and found out about this. Now I know why I felt the need to pick up a sixpack on the way home.
There are some people you just can’t cheer for.* If it weren’t for King Felix, I would renounce my M’s-fan status too. For now, I’ll just have to switch channels when Everett comes to the plate.
*For the grammar police: There are some people for whom one just cannot cheer.
I am not happpy about the Krazy Karl signing for many of the reasons outlined in this thread, but I keep asking myself for a better option with similiar terms that doesn’t cost us talent and I can’t find a match. And I don’t feel like the M’s have any right to pinch pennies, so I don’t think the $3 million is relevant.
Most of the people who think this is a bad signing is because they feel he is a bad person. Well I got news for you not many people in the baseball world are good people. I am excited about this signing I think it really helps us out.
Just a few random facts:
Carl Everett didn’t make an error last year in 22 starts in the OF
He was the 12th best in the AL in RBI per at bat ratio getting an RBI in about once every 5 at bats
He started 108 games played in 143 and still hit 23 HRs
…If you look on this STRICTLY on baseball this is a good signing please don’t say the guy is declining when he did what he did last season…
LETS GO CARL!
One positive — likely the sole one — is that this does, in fact, provide strong evidence that the “family friendly” notion that seems to have put strictures on the team’s moves in the past is no longer an issue. That’s not a positive with respect to signing Carl, but it at least gives hope that they wouldn’t be afraid to make a move for a player with “character issues” who is actually good.
Let me ask some of you guys this would you rather of had Frank Thomas as your DH instead of Everett?
#214: Kevin Millar didn’t make any errors in 34 games in the outfield. Do you think that makes him a good outfielder?
#216: Frank Thomas for how much money? Same deal as Jurassic Carl? Yes. Any more easy questions?
Here’s more Carl wackyness. Worth the read if you believe that hot chicks are demons from hell.
OOps, let’s try again. Here
K… than if some people would take Frank Thomas than you guys can’t say anything about how the White Sox didn’t offer Everett arbritration so something is wrong so Thomas is in that same boat… Also, Thomas is a guy in his declining years… So LB you don’t know anything… I will go sleep good tonight knowing my point got across with no good rebuttal from anyone…
[no, you haven't]
So, using your own statistical “analysis regarding the importance of RBIs/At Bats for Carl Everett, let’s look at Frank Thomas, who you are criticizing in the same vein, shall we?
Frank Thomas 2005: 105 AB, 12 HR, 26 RBI. That’s an RBI every four at bats.
Sign Frank Thomas OMG!@%#!!!
Who comes off the 40 man to make room for Everett? Baek?
211 – “mariners”
Have you taken the time to read the comments in this thread? Or the posts on this site, for that matter?
What does arbitration have to do with anything? Where are your supporting facts concerning Frank Thomas’ decline?
Please go back to the PI forum or at least take some time when framing your arguments and use facts, please.
221 – mariners,
How can you declare you got no good rebuttal without giving anyone the opportunity to rebut you?
I’m sure better arguments can be made, but: if Carl’s performance was so good last year, as you say, then perhaps it is weird that they didn’t try to keep him, and it can be a sign that he isn’t the good guy chuck and billy say he is. Meanwhile, Frank Thomas was injured all year, they have Jim Thome in his place now, and could let him go despite wanting to have his babies for the rest of eternity. Further implicating the notion that there is a non-baseball reason the Sox let him go is that they just traded an outfielder, so have even more use now for Carl than in the past.
I really don’t think the Sox letting Carl go, while complimenting his personality all the way, says much at all about Carl’s character. I think it says they saw how poor his abilities have become and knew he could be easily replace. And that he’s a schmuck, of course.
And now I go to bed knowing that you were left absolutely speechless by my post, cried yourself to sleep because you couldn’t think of anything to say, and woke up tomorrow knowing this was a bad signing for the M’s.
Here is the email I received after telling the Mariners what I thought of the Everett signing. It is a form letter, which is fine. I will be more than surprised if they actually have a “representative” email me.
“Dear Mariners Fan,
Thank you for your e-mail and interest in the Seattle Mariners. We
appreciate receiving your feedback and look forward to reading what you
have to say.
All of our fan e-mail is read and forwarded to the department best
suited to review each comment, question or concern. When appropriate,
you will receive a response from a Mariners representative regarding
your e-mail.
Please note, there are times when the volume of daily e-mail is quite
high and we may not be able to respond immediately. If you need a
quicker response, please call the Mariners Front Office at 206-346-4001
and a customer service representative will assist you.
Thank you for taking the time to write to us and we hope to see you at
the ballpark this season!
The Seattle Mariners”
And, I am sure I will be at the park this season, and I have to drive up from Vancouver. I am certainly not going to jump off a bridge because of Carl – just disappointed.
Sorry, that last post of mine was a bit rude. Its a frustrating time for a Mariner fan.
I was interested when Bavasi claimed Carl “is a clutch-hitting run producer with power,” so I looked it up:
299/351/495 in 107 ABs.
Oly Rainiers Fan
Now there’s the bright side to the Everett signing. Now I’ll save a little by going to even fewer M’s games next year. Of course, what I save on a Mariners game will be spent going to five or six Rainiers games. Who’s coaching them next season, anyway?
BTW, you’ll be happy to note that this is being composed on your favorite little computer.
Or is computer too grandiose a term?
No power in the ‘verse can get me to root for the SoDo MoFo. Yeah, I like that term.
Dissss-GUSTTTT-ting! Besides the fact that I thoroughly detest almost every act and behavior with which Carl Everett is identified, the move does nothing whatsoever to improve the team. This team _lost 90 last year_. Carl won’t make a dime’s worth of improvement in that. Callig him “a useful addition” and “lefthanded sock” is, flatly, an insult to the intelligence and commitment of this team’s fans.
. . . The worst move I’ve seen in this town since the trade for Heathcliff Slocumb, who had already failed as a reliever before he was bought for $1000 to the nickel he was worth. Bill Bavasi may have felt pressured to ‘do something’ in a tough market, but some times doing nothing is better. This is such a time. I’m leaning toward ‘doing nothing’ in the coming year when normally I would listen to or attend Ms baseball games. It’s not just the Everett signing, it’s the whole attitude with this FO: look to be trying hard, than put a spin on a next-to-last result. I, literally, don’t need that, or have time for it.
What’s worse? The last two seasons of squeaky clean,, Mariner boredom or Carl’s smashmouth baseball? I’m doing all I can to become discouraged about getting Everett but so help me I must conclude that this was a good move. FDR was fond of saying “Do something”. At least Bavasi did. He got the bat we needed at a K Mart price. The Mariners have distinguished themselves since 2004 as a sub standard baseball team. Something wicked may be coming our way but the M’s at this point are fresh out of options. They need Everett.
thros – Good news! We got the bat we needed? I hadn’t heard about that deal. Everyone’s been focusing on this idiotic Everett deal and the Mariners shrewdly swoop down and snatch the bat we needed! Cool!
Who is it?
[ot]
Hey, it could be worse. When I lived in Dallas the Rangers signed Everett AND John Rocker before the 2002 season…
Unless the M’s sign David Duke, this is far easier to take than Hart’s brilliant move.
I think Bavasi basically decided this was the guy with the most home runs who hits from the left side for the least amount of money on the market.
23 Home Runs + Left Handed + 3 million = Mariner.
It’s tragic that the Mariners GM isn’t smarter than that.
Based on the interview in the Sun Times linked to above, Carl hates the gay lifestyle (whatever that means), doesn’t believe in dinosaurs, and admits to being unfaithful to his wife.
Therefore I propose we form the first chapter of “Monogamous Gay Paleontologists”. I believe that incorporates everything that Carl apparently doesn’t like.
My hope is to get our group’s name up on the screen on opening day. “Monogamous Gay Paleontologists welcome Carl to Seattle” is what I’m envisioning.
Our group will not discriminate. One does not have to be particularly faithful, gay, or skilled in science to join. Though anyone who does happen to be a married gay paleontologist will get a free membership as well as a free beer at the game.
BTW, just got the BP newsletter. Anyone ever heard of Twins farmhand, Francisco Liriano?
Hey, good news everybody! While checking my Mariners season ticket paperwork to see if the word ‘nonrefundable’ was located anywhere near the word ‘deposit’ (it’s not, and in one place, it says ‘refundable deposit’, all contiguous like that…whew), I noted that tomorrow is in fact an important date for all of us season ticket holders.
The Mariners will be mailing us our final payment invoices tomorrow.
Timing is everything.
This signing really depresses me about the future of the Mariners for as long as current management is in place. I think I am most incredulous that Howard Lincoln doesn’t realize how signing a player who despite having the money to hire a quality attorney, has actually been convicted of abusing his children!!!, undermines everything he, Lincoln, has said in the past about how the team makes personnel decisions.
Since becoming a father a few years ago, my feelings about some things have become much more intense. When I hear about young children having bruises and welts on their heads, faces, and necks, it REALLY upsets me. I can’t see myself rooting for a player who does that to his children during a game, and honestly I’m not sure how much I want to root for his team. That may seem excessive to some people who read this site, but like I said I feel pretty intensely about little children getting getting hit hard enough on the head and face to cause bruises and welts. I think that there are enough mothers and fathers who feel similar to me to conclude that the Mariners did some damage to their “family friendly” feeling at the park with this signing. This just seems so obviously a stupid decision.
#239 (Steve K) – I understand your sentiment. I grew up in an abusive hosuehold where my father liked using belts (amongst other things) to drive his points home. I can get past the dinosaur thing and the gay thing and all of that, because in those instances he is just being ignornant and is only hurting himself. With abuse, he’s obviously hurting others and hurting children is one of the most cowardly things a man can do.
I’m sure I’ll still watch the M’s next year. I never really attend the games in person anyhow, so that’s no difference for me (hate the parking and traffic crap). But, as someone previously suggested, I might just change the channel temporarily when Carl Everett is at bat. Never thought much of him as a human being prior to today, still don’t. And all of this is without even beginning to analyze his declining baseball skills and dissecting the poor move by the FO from a baseball standpoint… it’s just pathetic on several levels.
[a, no. b, see comment guidelines]
Corporal punishment is part of some cultures. You either agree with it or you don’t. I am not sure if Carl’s way with his kids belongs in that category or goes too far though. Probably the latter.
Let’s just have a frickin’ beer and hope the doof hit’s 30 bombs…goodnight!
So, character wasn’t really the main factor in personnel decisions made by the M’s in the past. It was that in prior year’s the cheap free agents happened to have fairly good character. It seems to me the M’s looked at this “crazy” market this year and simply wouldn’t adjust to it, so they went for crazy instead of good.
They dipped into last year’s market and just got semi-burned(I’m fine with Beltre,myself), so it’s back to hoping some decent player will sign with the M’s for below market in years and $.
BB with his marching orders from Hoard, ” Where am I going to find any sort of left handed sock for 1 year @ 3mil? Well there’s Carl Everett, but Howie wouldn’t go for a MoFo like that! Oh well, might as well try.”
Hey, how about them Seahawks? A good GM with a hands off FO can do wonders.
So, who got moved from the 40-man after the Everett signing? I assume now that the Rule 5 period is over, there’s no implications on moving this player off?
Things I have hated about the FO these past couple of years:
1. DFA for Olerud. Wasn’t classy or smart.
2. Signing Everett. Ditto.
3. Giving Ben Christensen the time of day. Ditto again.
The FO markets the team as “family friendly”, but when it comes down to it, it means nothing more than kicking you out of the park if they don’t like your t-shirt. When they make decisions, they clearly don’t give a tinker’s cuss about real values.
And it’s not as if I really care about them being family-friendly, or the players being super nice guys: I’ll never meet these folks, I won’t know or talk to them, so they can all be homophobe luddites for all it really matters to me (insofar as I don’t want there to be any jerks in the world, but who am I kidding on that score?) I want the team to win, and if hiring a couple of jerks will help, then I can be fine with that.
But failing to identify good talent, overpaying for mediocre talent, and dealing with the only few folks whom I actively *do* care about what lousy people they are, that’s hard to stomach. Jerks are one thing, but the M’s have shown real openness to guys that go well beyond that.
Good to see Carl Everett in town already … hope Chuck Armstrong will splurge on dinner in Capitol Hill and tickets to the exclusive Seattle engagement of “Brokeback Mountain” tonight ….
K… than if some people would take Frank Thomas than you guys can’t say anything about how the White Sox didn’t offer Everett arbritration so something is wrong so Thomas is in that same boat… Also, Thomas is a guy in his declining years… So LB you don’t know anything… I will go sleep good tonight knowing my point got across with no good rebuttal from anyone…
Point out to me, if you would be so kind, where I mentioned the word “arbitration” in any of my comments. Then would you please explain how the White Sox could offer arbitration to Frank Thomas when his existing contract contained a $10.3m option for 2006.
Even if it had been possible (doubtful, but you seem to know more about arbitration then I do), the largest pay cut that an arbitrator could have given him under the CBA would have brought his salary down to around $8m.
I told you I’d take Thomas for Everett money, which is reported to be in the $4m range.
Last three years, OPS+ for Everett: 124, 85, 94.
Last three years, OPS+ for Big Hurt: 149, 151, 131.
Thomas for $4m for a single year? Every day I take that deal, and twice on Tuesdays.
Virtually all free agents are in their declining years. Frank Thomas is declining from a Hall of Fame level, and Carl Everett never reached that level in the first place.
Sleep well tonight, my friend.
If any of you who are threatening to turn in your season tickets have good seats, let me know…
In 2004, the PI (maybe the News Tribune, who remembers?) ran a survey of the Mariners. 22 of them voted for Bush. If you are a person of liberal values, you probably would be best served to forget about the politics of your favorite player. Unless he is Carlos Delgado.
I sat behind the bench in Tacoma one night, and was treated to the sound of a (beloved) ex-Mariner going off on a diatribe about gay people (he used a few different terms, though) with a couple of the team coaches. I suspect that there are a few virulent homophobes in the game. Yeah, Everett, Rocker, Todd Jones, etc win extra jackass points for speaking up in public, but I don’t think they are alone.
I’d recommend you all think about this as a baseball signing, where I’d give it a C-. Someone above said this is the same as the Spiezio deal, but you were wrong. That was a three year deal, the same mistake they could have made with Jacque ‘the missing S’ Jones. With a one-year deal, they can try to flip him, or even cut him loose if Snelling can carry the job. If they are in contention, they can upgrade at the deadline without any long-term consequence.
Now, they could have made a run at Thomas or Nomar on a one-year deal. But neither of them can play the outfield, and both of them have missed a lot of ball in the last couple years due to injury. Personally, I’d have waited to see what the non-tenders brought, or maybe tried to deal for Aubrey Huff.
I’d say forget the hand-wringing. This team is going to fall short next year. What they should be doing is marking time – take another year to see which of the kids gets to stay for the big push in ‘07. They didn’t need to make a multi-year committment to a mediocre or worse left fielder.
#249: The lone Democrats during that survey are now departed … Randy Winn and Bobby Madritsch. My understanding at the time was that most Mariners were Republicans because they felt the GOP would protect their salaries from “excessive” taxation.
Carl Everett hit .251/.311/.435 last year. If the season started two days ago, our everyday DH would be Greg Dobbs, who hit .246/.288/.331 last year. Everett has a good chance to hit even worse this year but Greg Dobbs is probably more likely to have an even larger decline from his career year.
That’s an increase of .134 OPS points. That’s like replacing Jeremy Reed 2005 with Johnny Damon 2005 or Richie Sexson 2005 with Albert Pujols 2005.
There were other cheap options (Mark Sweeney? Jeromy Burnitz? Magical trade?) but all of them had their flaws just like this one. It’s been argued here before, but most of next year’s improvement won’t come from having a new superstar bat, and instead come from taking PA’s and IP’s from guys like Sele, Meche, Valdez, Bloomquist, and Greg Dobbs. I just hope the M’s find a decent bench guy to take over when Everett is injured.
That’s the performance side. I hate hiring a bigot but, honestly, I’d rather have him come here than join a team like the Astros where his kind of nonsense is tolerated and/or encouraged.
Now, they could have made a run at Thomas or Nomar on a one-year deal. But neither of them can play the outfield …
Really, neither can Jurassic Carl. He can stand out there and catch what’s hit right to him, but Sexson could do the same if you needed to stick Thomas at 1B. And Nomar is open to playing anywhere in the infield or outfield, though he is indeed an injury risk.
Carl Everett is a mediocrity risk. And that’s the upside.
Thanks, Jim! I thought those two might have been the blue staters. I had thought maybe Spiezio, too. But then I saw that God-awful tattoo, and knew he was a fricken ditto-head like the rest of them.
The Mariners will continue their decline until Howard Lincoln is no longer involved with the team. He’s the baseball equivalent of Bob Whitsitt with the Seahawks and Wally Walker with the Sonics.
Re. #249 & #253:
Well, as it is, I’m a Libertarian; thus, there are just a few professional athletes who share my political perspectives.
Yet, that notwithstanding, I manage to view the Seattle Mariners — along with the Seattle Seahawks, Seattle Supersonics, et al. — as a collective group of ballplayers; therefore, I don’t get angry or upset toward the doltish individuals who comprise the team.
Lastly, for whatever it’s worth, Scott Spiezio is an idiot—regardless of his political beliefs and values.
I just can’t believe with all the past history of this guy that BB still signed him. This guy is a ticking time bomb and it’s not a matter of if he’ll explode it’s when. I can see it now. Carl grabbing his package at an opposing player or spitting at the ump, the fans booing him, and he drops trow at the fans. When that happens I doubt BB will be thinking about running down to home plate and kissing the behind of his left-handed bat with sock. Mariner fans we deserve better than this front office, coaching staff,and anyone else responsible. I have been a big fan of the Mariners for a long time but this signing makes me want to quit.
Yet, that notwithstanding, I manage to view the Seattle Mariners — along with the Seattle Seahawks, Seattle Supersonics, et al. — as a collective group of ballplayers; therefore, I don’t get angry or upset toward the doltish individuals who comprise the team.
As poster jacklamabe65 put it on Sons of Sam Horn: “They come, they go. We stay.”
I just wish Everett had skipped the first part.
Matt, others
I’m a screaming leftist and I don’t expect many bazillionaire baseball players to share my political views.
I do however ask that my team not sign players who abuse their children.
Whatever happened to Bucky Jacobson? Wasn’t he supposed to get called up after rehabbing?
Will one of the few brave, foolhardy Everett advocates produce a single baseball reason why Everett will help the team next year?
Where does Carl’s ’smash mouth’ baseball equate to above average production from a DH? The only mouth he’s smashed in the last few years probably belongs to one of his children.
How exactly are the M’s better off for signing Crazy Carl rather than engineering a trade for, say, Karim Garcia, to pick a name from Jim Thomson’s list? Better OBP, slugging, defence, versatility, or value for money? What about Carl makes you believe that he’s worth more than a kick in the arse?
And I’m particularly pissed of at that ‘Mariners’ jerk. Assininee, cherry-picking reasoning, arrogance and still lousy grammar. It’s “Would you rather HAVE had Frank Thomas…”.
‘of’ isn’t even a verb.
Bucky’s crocked, fat, out of shape and out of baseball. It’s a bit of a shame.
#259. Bucky was released from the Mariner organization in September. He is an unsigned free agent, last spotted camped out at Big Bubba Burger in downtown Hermiston, Ore.
Bucky is gone and not the answer either. However, a non aswer is better than the wrong answer. Everett is a step backwards. This definately effects my feelings towards this team. I can’t agree more with the article. We may get lucky, but why rely on luck? This is the most foolish move since sending Varitek and Lowe to Boston for Slocum. At least it isn’t as bad as that.
#237 Choska – Thanks for the best laugh today! Sign me up! : )
#248 Thanks, you said it better then I could in comment 234.
Ugh. I don’t particularly like Carl Everett as a ballplayer or a person, but this outcry is a little nuts.
Carl Everett improves this team. He takes the place of Gregg Dobbs as the everyday DH, meaning we go from a player who is probably worth -.5 wins to one who is worth 1.5 or so. That’s two wins, and let’s subtract a half win b/c of Raul Ibanez’s defense just to be fair. That’s a net gain of 1.5 wins with a complete lack of optimism by me about what Everett will do with the bat next year.
So there you go: the Mariners are a better team by replacing Gregg Dobbs with Carl Everett. That doesn’t mean the signing is an effective use of resources. In fact, most of us agree it is a poor one. But the Mariners as of 12/14 are a better team than the Mariners as of 12/13. I just wish we had chosen a “better” way to get better, but they are better.
Tempest in a teapot. He’s a potential contributing stop gap until Adam Jones, et al, is ready. If we get something better then his 2005 numbers for a 1 year 3 million deal, I will find someway to live with this.
Serious overreaction going on here.
Will one of the few brave, foolhardy Everett advocates produce a single baseball reason why Everett will help the team next year?
Dude, haven’t you been listening? 20 HR, 80 RBI.
I’m feeling optimistic.
3 Million. 1 year. That’s not that much commitment, and really not that much money, considering.
He takes the place of say, Greg Dobbs, our DH at the end of last year. Ah well, Dobbs sucks.
Everett is one of those lunging lefty hitters that primarily pulls the ball. One of those kinds of guys that would always launch the ball into the right field seats against the medeocre Mariner pitchers over the years. I can’t think of the last time we had a power hitting lefty guy capable of reaching that area on a regular basis. It’s the Safeco short porch, and we haven’t taken advantage of it after Griffey’s short Safeco stint.
I’m not saying it’s a good signing, but it’s not as bad as it could be either.
The Mariners are a pretty soft, boring team. Everett brings forth the fire. One of those cheap players to spike an opposing shortstop sliding into second to break up a double play ball. Maybe the Mariners NEED somebody like this. I’m not saying this is how baseball should be played, but it’s how a lot of other teams play. We haven’t had any fire since Lou moved to Tampa. Whining Boonie doesn’t count.
He works out, behaves himself, hits 30 homers and drives in 100 runs, and fans rejoice, and he’s around for 2007 as well. He sucks, well, we deal him at the deadline and give somebody else a shot.
Perhaps another reason to watch the games.
Voting for the “wrong” party is not a crime. Beating your kids is.
Voting for the other guy isn’t a social faux pas*. Grabbing your crotch and acting like a jerk in front of several thousdand fans (some of them young kids) is.
* – if you think it is, please realize that whoever you voted for last year, about 60 million fellow Americans voted for the other guy. In a healthy democracy, you respect each other’s choices, even the ones you disagree with.
Re. #260:
I, too, am not fond of either poor grammar or idiocy; nevertheless, I find it absolutely amusing that you, while ranting about poor grammar in your post, misspelled the term asinine.
Anyhow, no matter Carl Everett’s deteriorating skills and social ineptitude, Seattle Mariners VP/GM Bill Bavasi should’ve signed Jeromy Burnitz to play left field for the ballclub—there is no doubt ’bout it!
Well, crap! I spent the entire evening fixing my PC, finally got that done, logged on to USSM to find…this. So the team spent coin on someone who by most accounts is a head case with a declining skill set? Yeah, I hope CE goes out and is a model citizen and hits 30+ bombs too…of course, I also keep hoping that I have the winning Lotto ticket.
I’m sorry…it’s been a loooong day…but if the team’s goal is to “build for the future” how does a 1 year band aid signing help that…and an odd band aid at that???
Oh well…on the plus side maybe we can now go get Kenny Rogers and the 2 can take turns taking swings at people.
Rogers is a Tiger for the next 2 years.
Re: Everett replacing Dobbs.
Sure, Everett was better than Dobbs in 2005. But, Dobbs at least might improve, and he costs $3 million less.
And really, this isn’t a question of Everett replacing Dobbs. Everett is displacing whatever player we put there if we don’t get Everett. Chances are: not Dobbs. There are any number of journeymen available who would offer better DH production than Everett.
Even if they’re not left-handed. Another random player who hit better than Everett last year?
Jeff Cirillo.
I smell Speizio all over again, but with a little more power is all. YUCK!
#274: Jeff Cirillo
Good call. OPS+ of 110 versus Jurassic Carl’s 94 last year (and that’s a park-adjusted stat, too). And Cirillo’s only making $850k guaranteed! If we eat a few million of JC’s contract, you think the Brewers will make a trade?
I recall my mother taking a belt and beating my pet dinosaur with it.Then she hired a series of expensive ‘big guys’. Jeffy, Richie A, Scottie, Brety. None of them were able to hit the dinosaur.
She thought they must all be gaily overpaid. I assured her that sooner or later, someone will smack that dino for less than 8 mil a year; but he may be a jerk.
She’s OK with that. As long as he smacks the dinosaur..
Burnitz was pretty bad on the road the past 3 years, his numbers are helped by Wrigley and Coors. He’s older, more prone to fall off even faster. And, who’s to say that Burnitz even wants to play for Seattle? You can’t just go out and get anybody that you want, it has to be a mutual meeting. Signing Lee doesn’t give the lineup versatility by playing Everett in the outfield now and then. And who’s to say HE even wants to play for Seattle?
Everett actually hit .280 away from Chicago last year. Less power, but it’s expected. Considering the majority of our team fails to hit that well, it’s an upgrade to the schmucks we have. Maybe he backs it off a bit and becomes a better hitter in bigger ballparks. Hell if I know, I don’t think anybody knows what’s going through Crazy Carl’s mind.
My picks for the offseason lefty sock were Huff or Bigbie. Bigbie I feel can outperform Everett, but Bavasi chose for some future arms rather than Bigbie now in the Yorvit deal. Huff would be a step backwards in future contention and makes twice as much as Everett, and Huff himself has been in a decline.
This pretty much fills out the lineup. Johjima is a considerable upgrade over Olivo, last year’s starting opening day catcher. Betancourt has worlds of potential over Valdez, last year’s opening day shortstop, and Everett supplies more power than Winn, last year’s opening day starting left fielder, defense be-damned.
If the M’s sign Millwood, and make a swap or cheap signing for a quality 5th arm, we’ll be a decent club. I’m not saying a good club, but a decent one.
I still hate Bavasi, I’d like to see him out of town after 2006. At least with Everett around I get to open up the paper to potentially see some dimwitted, blunt, ignorant, but almost always comical Carl Everett comments.
#278: At least with Everett around I get to open up the paper to potentially see some dimwitted, blunt, ignorant, but almost always comical Carl Everett comments.
Why don’t you just do like fans have always done in the 29 MLB cities without Carl Everett: read the Letters to the Editor?
279. Fans don’t have near the pizazz that Everett has. I googled a few interviews, Everett is comedy gold. I’d go see him at Giggles if they brought him around for a guest night.
The next comic moment will be how the local mainstream media (TV & print) will tiptoe around Everett’s past, or just spin him as a guy with “fire in the belly and a world series champion”, as KOMO described him tonight. Good times!
Exactly my thoughts DJ…I didn’t want to see him, but He’s an M now so I’ll give him my support. Until he proves he doesn’t deserve it, that is. He could do well here. Ichiro may be partly to blame for this signing. saying that not everyone was playing hard may have caused the FO to look at getting a player who’d yell at ANYONE for not busting thier butt. Everett is that kind of perfectionist.
What do you think about getting SP by signing Damon so that the Red Sox need Reed? Maybe a five year $48mill? I don’t know if we need a lefty to bat second…Maybe if they were moving Ichiro to third in the line-up, but I guess that would make Yu-Bet 2nd by default. Interesting thought I hadn’t looked into until recently. Doesn’t make a lot of sense unless I’m missing something though. I think Reed could become better than Damon is. That would put three lefties in the line-up Who’ve hit 20 HR in a season though, not including Ichiro who hit 20 in Japan. 4 with 15+. although I think those are about career years for all of them…
“He was a key contributor to the White Sox championship season … hitting .300 in the postseason.”
This is a great example of using a small truth to tell a big lie. Mariner management wants you to believe, from this sentence, that Everett was a big contributor in the postseason for the White Sox. He wasn’t. It’s that simple. He was a non-factor.
He hit .300, yes. It was about the emptiest .300 possible. He hit 12 for 40, with one walk, and not a single extra base hit. That’s right, his slugging was also .300; his onbase was a hair better. He knocked in three runs in twelve games.
Key contributor, my ass.
Randy Winn’s SLG, 2004/2005:
.425/.499
Carl Everett’s SLG, 2004/2005:
.402/.425
The OBP’s aren’t very close, and the defense and baserunning…yeah.
Can we PLEASE stop saying Everett is an upgrade in any sense on Randy Winn?
I’m totally pissed. I wrote an email tp the M’s protesting this signing a week ago. I got a form letter in reply. This is more than a step back; it’s a slap in the face. The Mariners can take their $8 beer and shove it. I’m still a fan, but this does nothing to encourage me to drive from Portland to buy tickets. To quote Bob Whitsitt, “I’m not a chemistry major.”
Well, neither is Bavasi.
Larry Stone’s article today indicates that the M’s may be interested in Sir Sidney Ponson. It just keeps getting better.
Let’s just say Bavasi signed his pink slip.
[sorry, I'm posting an update on this now]
I don’t mind the signing, at least it brings an element of intrigue to an otherwise boring team. And who cares about the crotch grabbing incident, it was years ago. Jamie has probably forgotten about it and if he hasn’t and actually still harbors some ill will towards Everett, then he probably shouldn’t be playing professional baseball anymore. Guys get into fistfights with each other on the field and end up becoming teammates the next year people. It’s baseball, not a friendly game of croquet. As much as Soccer Mom and Corporate Dad wouldn’t like to believe, baseball has been and always will be a rugged, dirty hard nosed game and when it’s G rated, most of the time you’ll end up being on the losing end of things.
Let’s just say Bavasi signed his pink slip.
FUnctionally, yes….but I wonder if he went young and unknown, if he would have gotten approval from Armstrong et al or acquiesence from below (as in, Hargrove being an older school manager who’s more comfortable with vets).
#285 Youre right that Everett isnt an upgrade over Randy Winn…. Winn isnt on the roster. By the way, before you crunch the numbers, Everett isnt an upgrade over Edgar either. Griffey is a better centerfielder too. Heck, I bet Floyd Bannister is a better pitcher than Everett (though I havent ran the numbers).
Anyone know who got dropped off the 40-man to accomodate Everett?
This kills me. I can’t even find myself hoping this guy does well. If he does well, he almost definitely will be back for 2007. **GUARANTEE** The FO will release the Sodo Mofo before his contract is up.
#208: Yes, I heard that on the radio last night.
This signing says a lot about Hargrove. As if we needed anything else.
I think there is a better than even chance that Hargrove will be gone this time next year.
Bavasi did what his manager asked for. His manager though, is an idiot when it comes to talent evaluation and knowing what wins ballgames.
It will be a sad and shameful day for Seattle when the Gay Paleo Club shows up at the ballpark to make fun of Carl Everett’s religious beliefs.
#270– “He works out, behaves himself, hits 30 homers and drives in 100 runs, and fans rejoice, and he’s around for 2007 as well.”
fwiw, the White Sox reporter on KJR this morning says that Carl historically comes into camp out of shape.
[error:word ration approached 1:1]
Nice job on spelling Bavasi and Wilson corrrectly. The dinosaures may not be very happy though.
Another reason to hate Carl Everett: Him breaking up a perfect game Mike Mussina had after 8 2/3 IP on Sunday Night Baseball a few years ago. That really pissed me off.
I’m a white sox fan and i have to tell you that everett’s charecter issues didn’t effect him on the field or any of his teamates. While your team obviously has a history with his prior actions give him another chance, how would he win a world series and be such a bad teamate. I’d be more concerned about him batting .250 with 150 strike outs for the year even though he’ll hit 30 hrs with a regular starting gig.(Frank thomas started for a while and took some of everett’s abs)