Comments on: USSM Mailbag: Meche heads to arbitration http://ussmariner.com/2006/01/23/ussm-mailbag-meche-heads-to-arbitration/ Seattle Mariners and general baseball discussion with David Cameron and Derek Zumsteg Sat, 21 Nov 2009 07:17:09 -0800 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5 hourly 1 By: Tod http://ussmariner.com/2006/01/23/ussm-mailbag-meche-heads-to-arbitration/comment-page-2/#comment-86923 Tod Thu, 26 Jan 2006 21:57:59 +0000 http://ussmariner.com/?p=3282#comment-86923 If I hold my nose and overlook the fact that Gil Meche is getting $3.7 million, Bavasi has demonstrated a nice trend of getting folks such as Bloomquist and Meche to agree to less than a fifty-fifty split. I particularly like the Meche incentives, since they have improbably high thresholds - if he gets them, he will have earned his salary. (Of course, if the budget reserves for incentives on a dollar-for-dollar basis, as a fan their unlikely-acheiveability isn't doing much for me.) If I hold my nose and overlook the fact that Gil Meche is getting $3.7 million, Bavasi has demonstrated a nice trend of getting folks such as Bloomquist and Meche to agree to less than a fifty-fifty split. I particularly like the Meche incentives, since they have improbably high thresholds – if he gets them, he will have earned his salary. (Of course, if the budget reserves for incentives on a dollar-for-dollar basis, as a fan their unlikely-acheiveability isn’t doing much for me.)

]]> By: eponymous coward http://ussmariner.com/2006/01/23/ussm-mailbag-meche-heads-to-arbitration/comment-page-2/#comment-86919 eponymous coward Thu, 26 Jan 2006 19:57:11 +0000 http://ussmariner.com/?p=3282#comment-86919 Heard on KJR that Meche and the M's have come to terms (I'd assume at the halfway point). Heard on KJR that Meche and the M’s have come to terms (I’d assume at the halfway point).

]]> By: Badperson http://ussmariner.com/2006/01/23/ussm-mailbag-meche-heads-to-arbitration/comment-page-2/#comment-86837 Badperson Wed, 25 Jan 2006 17:55:05 +0000 http://ussmariner.com/?p=3282#comment-86837 #51, It seems to me that the one tiny advantage Meche has is that we only are stuck with him for a year. With free agents, it's often hard to avoid longer contracts. I'm fairly sure we could have gotten Kevin Brown for a year (since he's so old) but I don't see why he would be leaps and bounds better than Meche. I agree with your angst over the Everett+Washburn+Meche = Johson+Millwood+Loaiza, I just got done having it when we signed Washburn. As far as Moyer not being a good risk, I think the Moyer fans are squinting really hard at his home 2005 numbers. In the article about Defense on this site, I learn that a good sample size is 2 years. Over the last 2 years, Moyer struck out 5/9 ip, and walked 2.6/9 ip. I don't have his groundball percentage rate, but he did give up 67 dingers in that time so I doubt it was stupendous. Apply a reasonable amount of regression for being 43 years old, and you get what? 4.5K/9ip, 3bb/9ip? Whoopee. #51, It seems to me that the one tiny advantage Meche has is that we only are stuck with him for a year. With free agents, it’s often hard to avoid longer contracts. I’m fairly sure we could have gotten Kevin Brown for a year (since he’s so old) but I don’t see why he would be leaps and bounds better than Meche.

I agree with your angst over the Everett+Washburn+Meche = Johson+Millwood+Loaiza, I just got done having it when we signed Washburn.

As far as Moyer not being a good risk, I think the Moyer fans are squinting really hard at his home 2005 numbers. In the article about Defense on this site, I learn that a good sample size is 2 years. Over the last 2 years, Moyer struck out 5/9 ip, and walked 2.6/9 ip. I don’t have his groundball percentage rate, but he did give up 67 dingers in that time so I doubt it was stupendous. Apply a reasonable amount of regression for being 43 years old, and you get what? 4.5K/9ip, 3bb/9ip? Whoopee.

]]> By: eponymous coward http://ussmariner.com/2006/01/23/ussm-mailbag-meche-heads-to-arbitration/comment-page-2/#comment-86836 eponymous coward Wed, 25 Jan 2006 17:31:52 +0000 http://ussmariner.com/?p=3282#comment-86836 DMZ, which part DID make sense? I couldn't tell. On the point in 54- Well, I suspect we would, because he MIGHT be executing the Chris Carpenter/Jason Schmidt turnaround at age 27, and going from being a pitcher with no idea where the ball's going to a good pitcher. My problem is that paying $4 million to see if he can do this is the roster equivalent of taking your 401k when you retire and buying lottery tickets as a wealth-building strategy. Could it pay off? Sure. Is it a wise strategy? No, not really. DMZ, which part DID make sense? I couldn’t tell.

On the point in 54- Well, I suspect we would, because he MIGHT be executing the Chris Carpenter/Jason Schmidt turnaround at age 27, and going from being a pitcher with no idea where the ball’s going to a good pitcher. My problem is that paying $4 million to see if he can do this is the roster equivalent of taking your 401k when you retire and buying lottery tickets as a wealth-building strategy. Could it pay off? Sure. Is it a wise strategy? No, not really.

]]> By: Mr. Egaas http://ussmariner.com/2006/01/23/ussm-mailbag-meche-heads-to-arbitration/comment-page-2/#comment-86829 Mr. Egaas Wed, 25 Jan 2006 07:48:37 +0000 http://ussmariner.com/?p=3282#comment-86829 When it comes down to it, we can't really win with Meche. We're already paying him 4 million plus... if he has a good season, he'll likely command a large, multi-year deal, if not from us, than from somebody else. Do we really want to give him that, if he posts one solid season? When it comes down to it, we can’t really win with Meche. We’re already paying him 4 million plus… if he has a good season, he’ll likely command a large, multi-year deal, if not from us, than from somebody else. Do we really want to give him that, if he posts one solid season?

]]> By: DMZ http://ussmariner.com/2006/01/23/ussm-mailbag-meche-heads-to-arbitration/comment-page-2/#comment-86827 DMZ Wed, 25 Jan 2006 07:27:16 +0000 http://ussmariner.com/?p=3282#comment-86827 That made almost no sense at all. That made almost no sense at all.

]]> By: Edgar For Pres http://ussmariner.com/2006/01/23/ussm-mailbag-meche-heads-to-arbitration/comment-page-2/#comment-86826 Edgar For Pres Wed, 25 Jan 2006 06:48:38 +0000 http://ussmariner.com/?p=3282#comment-86826 I'd rather go with Meche than go dumpster diving. Meche has been consistantly inconsistant and has pissed us all off at points. He's going to be on our team for the same reason that Thorton will be on the team. I hope Meche puts it together next year. If he does great, if he doesn't then bump him out of the rotation. I think(hope) Meche will likely do better than Moyer this year. He's one of the guys that I still want to see put it together. He's still only 27 and has some stuff that can be good but just needs to be consistant for an entire game. $4 mil is a little steep but I think its a better deal than any FA on the market. I’d rather go with Meche than go dumpster diving. Meche has been consistantly inconsistant and has pissed us all off at points. He’s going to be on our team for the same reason that Thorton will be on the team. I hope Meche puts it together next year. If he does great, if he doesn’t then bump him out of the rotation. I think(hope) Meche will likely do better than Moyer this year. He’s one of the guys that I still want to see put it together. He’s still only 27 and has some stuff that can be good but just needs to be consistant for an entire game. $4 mil is a little steep but I think its a better deal than any FA on the market.

]]> By: eponymous coward http://ussmariner.com/2006/01/23/ussm-mailbag-meche-heads-to-arbitration/comment-page-2/#comment-86808 eponymous coward Wed, 25 Jan 2006 00:21:59 +0000 http://ussmariner.com/?p=3282#comment-86808 Seriously? You could have picked up Jason Johnson for about what you're going to pay Meche. You could dumpster dive for the Halamas and Browns of the world on NRIs (I don't like Kevin Brown's chances of being very good very much...but he might have a better shot than Gil Meche). Sift through the young arms and wait for the midseason to pull in another starter. I wasn't aware that Tomko went to LA for that much- under the circumstances, no I wouldn't have gone for him. <i>As to him playing better last year than Everett, yeah, but he’s a year older this year.</i> So's Everett, and Moyer's usefulness at this age isn't ENTIRELY unprecedented- knuckleballers and guys like Warren Spahn made it to this point. He's a risk, sure. As far as a big risk...not really. I wouldn't have sobbed bitter tears if we had gone a different direction, mind you. But what's frustrating, though? Add up Everett, Meche, Moyer and Washburn and you're VERY close to Johnson, Millwood and Loaiza... and you still have Matt Lawton, and you might even be able to scrounge up a RH bat to platoon in LF for 750K to 1 million. Aaaargh. Seriously? You could have picked up Jason Johnson for about what you’re going to pay Meche. You could dumpster dive for the Halamas and Browns of the world on NRIs (I don’t like Kevin Brown’s chances of being very good very much…but he might have a better shot than Gil Meche). Sift through the young arms and wait for the midseason to pull in another starter.

I wasn’t aware that Tomko went to LA for that much- under the circumstances, no I wouldn’t have gone for him.

As to him playing better last year than Everett, yeah, but he’s a year older this year.

So’s Everett, and Moyer’s usefulness at this age isn’t ENTIRELY unprecedented- knuckleballers and guys like Warren Spahn made it to this point. He’s a risk, sure. As far as a big risk…not really. I wouldn’t have sobbed bitter tears if we had gone a different direction, mind you. But what’s frustrating, though? Add up Everett, Meche, Moyer and Washburn and you’re VERY close to Johnson, Millwood and Loaiza… and you still have Matt Lawton, and you might even be able to scrounge up a RH bat to platoon in LF for 750K to 1 million. Aaaargh.

]]> By: Grizz http://ussmariner.com/2006/01/23/ussm-mailbag-meche-heads-to-arbitration/comment-page-1/#comment-86807 Grizz Wed, 25 Jan 2006 00:03:49 +0000 http://ussmariner.com/?p=3282#comment-86807 The small sample size red flag applies to Bazardo's winter league stats. Matt Thornton posted crazy good K/BB last winter, and it did not help him come spring. Bazardo is certainly promising, but his AA stats (142 IP, 99/47 K/BB, 16 HR, 4.06 raw ERA, 1.56 G/F) do not suggest he's major league ready. Let him spend some time in Tacoma finding consistency for his curve and developing his change. The Meche tender reflects that, while the M's have some good upper level arms, it would be unfair to expect any of them to step right into a rotation spot out of spring training. The small sample size red flag applies to Bazardo’s winter league stats. Matt Thornton posted crazy good K/BB last winter, and it did not help him come spring.

Bazardo is certainly promising, but his AA stats (142 IP, 99/47 K/BB, 16 HR, 4.06 raw ERA, 1.56 G/F) do not suggest he’s major league ready. Let him spend some time in Tacoma finding consistency for his curve and developing his change.

The Meche tender reflects that, while the M’s have some good upper level arms, it would be unfair to expect any of them to step right into a rotation spot out of spring training.

]]> By: LF Monster http://ussmariner.com/2006/01/23/ussm-mailbag-meche-heads-to-arbitration/comment-page-1/#comment-86803 LF Monster Tue, 24 Jan 2006 23:14:43 +0000 http://ussmariner.com/?p=3282#comment-86803 Bazardo is a cheaper option. Rich Dorman is a cheaper option. I think PR wise you wouldn't want to dump Meche and replace him with anything in house short of an excellent young starter. But a few young guys are proving what they can in Winterball. Bazardo is a cheaper option. Rich Dorman is a cheaper option. I think PR wise you wouldn’t want to dump Meche and replace him with anything in house short of an excellent young starter. But a few young guys are proving what they can in Winterball.

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