Game 144, Blue Jays at Mariners
Marcum vs Meche, 7:05 pm.
Okay, it might not be a great reason, but at least you might sort of care how Gil Meche finishes out the year, since it could affect what type of draft pick compensation we get when he walks away as a free agent this winter. That’s better than last night, when there just wasn’t a reason to watch.
Line-Up:
1. Ichiro, CF
2. Beltre, 3B
3. Betancourt, SS (6-27 as #3 hitter – .222/.222/.222. Only Grover would think this is working.)
4. Ibanez, LF
5. Sexson, 1B
6. Broussard, DH
7. Johjima, C
8. Lopez, 2B
9. Doyle, RF (Carl Everett went 0-16 about 142 times and never got dropped in the order…)
Line-ups by in large don’t matter, but they do serve as small insights into a manager’s ability to think critically. Or, in this case, have absolutely no idea about what kind of skills the player on his team possess.
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Well, it could be worse… Doyle could be benched in favor of the Ignitor. (it’s really sad when you have to start a comment on the lineup with a resigned “it could be worse”)
Home much worse would the lineup be if they kept Ichiro at lead off and selected the 2-9 hitters randomly?
“How much” not “Home much” of course. Speaking of home… it’s been a long work day. Time to go home.
To put it another way: as the #3 hitter, Betancourt’s OPS + BA is lower than Ryan Howard’s slugging percentage.
I do like seeing Beltre back at #2, maybe that will help him get out of his funk.
The worse part of Grover’s line-ups and in-game decision making is that the outcome of his decisions has greatly affected my ability to care about this team.
I’m a Mariner’s fan and I stuggle to like them or to watch them. I do watch and listen. I check the box after each game and I quickly glance with pain at the standings. However I find it difficult to go to Safeco field for a game. I love watching MLB and Grover has made it unfun. He is a “fun sucker” to quote a silly movie.
Grover also seems to think that Joh is absolutely incapable of batting anywhere except #7. Unfortunately, tomorrow we will see Rivera catching, thus making the M’s transform from a poor hitting AL team to a poor hitting NL team, with Rivera hitting like a pitcher.
Carl Everett went 0-16 about 142 times and never got dropped in the order…
Chris Snelling is not a Proven Veteran®.
Wow. This lineup makes me think my time would be better spent renting a van and driving for 6 hours to random points around Western Washington.
This lineup sucks. Luckily today is my 21st birthday and I will be drunk in a bar.
Corco, it’s just not the same with you posting not from Idaho.
Spent yesterday at Priest Lake clearing my old dock from the beach. No place is better in Idaho…
David Andriesen at the P-I found a more positive way to say “he’s hitting .222″:
“He had at least one hit in each of his first five games (before going hitless Monday night) after making the switch.”
“Betancourt insists moving to better lineup real estate hasn’t changed his approach.”
“For me, I just go up there to bat,” he said through an interpreter. “I don’t think about those things.”
“And that, says manager Mike Hargrove, is exactly why the move has been successful.”
Your hometown Seattle P-I, folks.
Idaho is the shit.
But if I were in Idaho the comment would have raead
“Wow. This lineup makes me think my time would be better spent getting in my car and driving for 6 hours to random points around Eastern Washington.”
yay beltre
#5
You are clearly the smartest man to ever walk God’s green Earth!
*cough*
Hey, Yuni got a double, so his #3 slot OPS just went up a skosh.
“Having just finished the greatest display of offense by a shortstop in the history of baseball, there’s only one question left to ask:
Where did this 2007 season come from?
‘It all started at the end of last year,” Betancourt said through an interpreter. ‘When (Hargrove) started batting me 3rd in the lineup, I decided it would probably be better to hit like Manny Ramirez, and so I did.’
But no one, even Betancourt, could have predicted the .350/60/140 line that was going to follow. Or could they have?
‘Were we surprised at his numbers? Not really,’ Hargrove said. ‘When we moved him up in the order last year, (Betancourt) didn’t change his approach. He just went up there to bat and didn’t think about those things, and we knew that he was going to be successful.’”
I don’t like Doyle batting 9th, as his punishment for an 0-16 slump, but here it is with RISP.
not that the game isn’t holding my attention, but there is lots of slobbery Yankee love going on over at BBTN, with the return of Matsui (who allowed himself to smile just a little) and 6 1st inning RBIs for Abreu.
Doyle!
Yay Doyle!
Man some wicked Unclie Charlies tonight
Strange lineup indeed, but consider that the bottom of the order over the weekend featured the likes of Rivera, Bloomquist, Morse. Jo, Jose, and Doyle make for a pretty formidable trio down there and they got the job done(but Betancourt and Snelling are not in the right slots).
gameday sucks and I am in Australia (no TV games)
what pitch did Doyle hit? count etc?
Man… typical Beltre at bat already, layed off the meat down the pipe and swings at a pitch a mile away from the strikezone, twice.
What are the odds Yuni works the count, to walk in another run?
Zero
Well, we can just blame Corcoran:
Abreu, who has 31 RBIs in 41 games since the Yankees acquired him from Philadelphia, homered off starter Tim Corcoran (4-8) for a 3-0 lead, a drive off an advertisement board attached to the bottom of the upper deck in right field….Abreu became the first Yankees player with six RBIs in an inning since Gil McDougald in the ninth on May 3, 1951, at the St. Louis Browns.
I really promise I am not related to him, at least as far as 4th cousin. I don’t really know any further because that was when we came to America.
23. 2-1 changeup
Yep. Isn’t there one of those un-written rules, don’t swing at the first pitch with the bases loaded….if you’re a rookie?
If Toronto, a better team than the Mariners, is playing Lind and Barker tonight, why is Adam Jones sitting?
Unless it’s a movement free 88 MPH fastball sent right down the middle, you shouldn’t swing at the first pitch with the bases loaded.
Yay Ibanez
#31– where would you have Adam play?
OK Gameday froze – Lopez made some sort of out(s)
And batting 9th, once again, with runners in scoring position…..
Wow, Grover is a genius, his idea of having Doyle hit 9th was so he could have RISP opportunities.
* Note to self * The Mariners have a lead, and you know that you’ve already seen the most excitment possible out of this game. Go rent a movie.
No no-no.
2: is that not what Hargrove did?
sigh… Wells.
Meche has turned a corner! again! i think he’s going in circles now.
No shutout.
34. Well, adventurous as it would be, they are grooming him to be a center fielder. I would consider rotating four outfielders: Ibanez, Ichiro, Snelling, and Jones in various combinations so that everyone is playing three out of four games. A little extra rest wouldn’t hurt the 30-plus crowd. It is September and they aren’t going anywhere. But I’m not managing for my job like Hargrove is.
I’ll take a gander at the trivia question that it was a “Ground Rule” Homerun, but Dave mentioned it was “One word”, I remember hearing something about Al Lopez hitting a homerun that bounced over the wall, not sure what year. I think it was some sort of NL rule, and it eventually became the “Ground rule double” instead of a homerun.
good answer #44, you must have read baseball almanac.com today
43: Heck, rotate Sexson in there so they get 4 out of 5 days. You can put Raul at first.
amazing how fast Doyle’s little stubby legs can carry him…
I can’t exactly recall what I heard that from, but it wasn’t baseball almanac… I think I watched a NL vs AL documentary in History class once, and they were talking about the various differences in rules between the leagues, and mentioned the Bounced Home run. I had a cool history teacher
Betancourt is doing wonders to his #3 slot OPS tonight!
Betancourt!!!
Kind of.
i found it on that website today when researching a trivia question for tonight, i had never heard that that rule was still in play so late in the 20th century. it seemed like a typical 1800’s rule.
Gameday is broken again. Yuni walked? Were the pitches in the dirt, or over his head?
11: i’ve never been to Priest Lake, but I have discovered that the only 3 digit state highway in Idaho runs through there. I would be interested to see the sign.
K. 6 for Meche.
Now if only he could do other things better.
The Mariners have 9 hits a Yuni walk two HRs knocked the starter out in the third and lead 3-2?????
digger,
the mariners are about as successful in scoring runs as you were in keeping all that oil
55: It’s that Yuni walk. Any pitcher that walks Yuni must be doing something wrong.
yuni this season in a nice hitters count . . . 2-1 count
80 pitches, 62 swings, 17 called balls, 1 called strike
Hey, Minnesota came from behind to beat Oakland – cool. I would really love to see both them and the ChiSox in the playoffs.
12 hits through 5 equals 4 runs? There has to be an equation behind that.
G + L/ P*B= No chance in hell at winning more than %48 of games played.
Legend:
G= Grover factor L= Lineup P= Plate Patience (Or lack thereof)
B= Bad pitching, Bad signings, Bad outfield dimensions, Bad anything.
And ‘B’ can also mean Bad bench usage (or lack thereof).
Zaun LH 9 hrs 31 rbis
Zaun RH 0 1
go get the right hander
Zaun LH 9 hrs 31 rbis
Zaun RH 0 1
go get the right hander
Did I read the in game box correctly?
We got NINE hits in less than three innings off of Marcum (including two dingers) and STILL only got three runs? I’m almost afraid to ask how that must have occured…sigh
nice shot of the on deck area on TV
And benefited from a couple errors as well.
Here’s Mr. Grandslam.
yay huber.
clutch pitching tonight
64- seems out of place for Seattle
Vintage Beltre AB there.
Another sad, quiet game thread, I see.
Grover and Gibbons are attempting to make this game last as long as possible to increase the number of comments.
64 & 68, hair is now disheveled, and it’s stretch time, eyes are glossy, words may be slurred.
I got sidetracked trying to track down a dvd publisher– who, as most of their content appears to be violating copyright, oddly enough doesn’t seem to want to be found…
hey, I missed Cesar Jimenez last night? see, you just shouldn;t bail early, even when it is a disheartening game…
So I was sitting down at the Big Time earlier tonight, beside Mr Barstool Expert and his sidekick. “Zito is going to get $36M for 3 years, and the M’s are going to have to pay it…” (uh, he’s going to get more than 3 years, and there are better options) “…because the M’s have no farm system, well, except for Felix but he came out of nowhere” (uh, yeah, whatever) “Sexson is the worst clutch hitter on the team” (uh, isn’t he closing in on a record for grand slams?) “Raul is the MVP of this team, they should extend his contract” (uh, they already did) “They should’ve traded Ichiro at the deadline in July” (uh, and that would accomplish what, exactly?) “Meche has really turned a corner, the M’s need to keep him but knowing them they probably won’t” (uh, oh, never mind). I’m silently humming to myself trying to stay sane and watch the game. In the middle of this Betancourt walks. Betancourt. Walks. “Holy crap” I say and they look at me like I just grew a second head. Hello, pigs fly, camels slip through the eyes of needles, Betancourt walks. OK, whatever. Bad idea, driving to a bar where people say things that make you drink. The new dopplebock is 8%, btw.
hey, I think that guy sat behind me earlier this year!
BTW, that Lopez chopper that scored Richie was really cool. Serious hang time. Not often you see a ball hit and bounce right in front of the plate with men on and everybody’s safe. Took forever for the TV score guy to figure out Sexson had actually scored, though.
not to be confused with the fella on sunday who thought Beltre was in Tacoma, maybe on a rehab assignment?
I am listening on radio. Did it look like Snelling was hurt?
Gameday here. Just saw that Bohn was put in for Snelling after the HBP. Any word?
doyle appeared to be holding his arm, but i would not say that he appeared to be hurt.
So I was sitting down…
Most hilarious post I’ve read here in a while! Thanks for sharing.
I really don’t understand why Joel is in the game… It’s not like this game means much, and Joel isn’t coming back next year… Let one of the rookies pitch. Pull a Jeff Nelson on Joel.
Or it means Lilly’s getting his ass kicked in the 4th and taking a bunch of losses.
Yeah. Made me think “he’s either great or awful.”
Even when JJ gives up a hit, he looks on top of things.
Who’s in love with all these bloody fastballs. In a 2 strike count let them try to hit the splitter.
Oh well, it doesn’t matter.
fawk yea!
A classic Guardado-style save.
4 runs counts as seeing the bats “explode”???
WTF? Things have been bleak this half.
I was just drinking beer and watching the end of the game at a bar with my buddy, and he had never seen Putz pitch before. So I told him to pay attention to the game, because he has a filthy splitter. And after that, he responded by throwing about 10 consecutive fastballs. And then the game ended. The point is that J.J. needs to throw his splitter.
He has clearly been avoiding it for weeks. I’m guessing it hurts his elbow to throw that pitch. Alternatively, he could be extremely stubborn.
91: Then they should shut him down. It seems like the common sense solution. That’s why I can’t believe that the reason he isn’t throwing his splitter is because his elbow is sore.
First time poster here. First off I want to say that I love the site and I read it just about everyday. There is a lot of good insight here.
It seems like some people were against Pineiro pitching in the 8th. Personally I don’t see the harm, relief pitching is much different than starting and Joel has seemed to respond to the pen.
I don’t see this recent bullpen success saving his career in Seattle, but it is something and I don’t mind the M’s giving him some looks in high-leverage spots.
Some buzz floating around that Wellington Dotel got busted for the 8-letter S word. Anybody else confirm this?
That’s the line on ESPN.com
Mariners minor leaguer Dotel hit with 50-game ban
Blimey, it worked. I can code!
Went to the game tonight, a few notes:
1) a lot of Blue Jays fans… or Canadians. Either way, it was almost as loud when Wells hit his jack than it was for Beltre. And I don’t think THAT many people have Wells in Fantasy (I do).
2) I was referring to Snelling as Doyle, of course. Several people in my section (125, rows 13-16, seats 15-20) asked why I was calling him that. I explained about USSMariner and the attempt to end the injury curse. Throughout the game, I could hear other “GO DOYLE” shouts from other sections. Good work spreading the name.
3) I think the best beer deal in the park is the 6.50 Guinness.
huh? Guinness? where?!?
Just like to note that the M’s have 69 victories this year, giving them as many as they had last year with 18 to go. If they continue at their current winning percentage the rest of the way they’ll finish 77-85.
They can still make it to .500 with a 12-6 finish.
Well, we’re 13-7 since that 11 game losing streak ended.
I was in the best seats I’ve ever had last night (Diamond club), 1st row, right behind the M’s on deck circle. It’s nice to have friends and take advantage of the last good night of the summer. I was close enough to smell Kenji’s stinky shin guard when he warmed up to bat.
Some observations…..
Meche’s yakker was on for the first 3 innings. Incredibly tight spin. His untapped potential still amazes me but his inability to keep it together for 6+ innings consistently means I don’t want to spend any cash on him this offseason.
Doyle had to have heard me calling him Doyle when he went to bat.
It would be really hard to work in front of 44k fans sitting a few feet from me, commenting on my ability (think hostile road crowd in the playoffs).
Putz threw some great splitters during warm up but only threw 1 (that I saw) in the 9th. His splitter actually snakes its way to the plate instead of dropping. It’s amazing to watch up close.
Beltre had some classic Beltre at bats. Toronto fielded a series of 5′ 9″ skinny pitchers. The M’s fielded a series of 6′ thick legged pitches. M’s have absolutely no patience at the plate.
If you ever get a chance to see how the other 1% lives (Diamond club), do it. You’ll probably never get closer to the players/game.
Morse is better than doyle
#102 – What criteria are you using in order to come to this conclusion?
#103 – Let me take a shot at that one:
Morse took steroids. That means he just “wants it” more than Doyle does. Doyle hasn’t “done what it takes” to get to the big leagues and Morse has. Morse will be a better player because he will do anything to get there.
Plus Doyle went 0-16, he obviously sucks.
# 103
Plus, Doyle is Australian.
Chris Snelling, minors:
.327/.398/.496 (.894 OPS) in 1594 ABs through 2005
.216/.326/.340 (.667 OPS) in 241 ABS on an injury rehab assignment in AAA in AAA in 2006
Mike Morse, minors:
.255/.309/.402 (.711 OPS) in 1758 ABs through 2005
.248/.300/.403 (702 OPS) in 206 ABs in AAA in 2006
Chris Snelling majors:
.250/.338/.431 (.769 OPS) in 116 ABs
Mike Morse, majors:
.285/.352/.381 (.733 OPS) in 260 ABs
Let’s not even get started about defense, where Mike Morse is charitably described as “slightly better than awful” and Snelling is a bit better than average.
Now, Chiro1523 (#102), go ahead and make your argument. But be sure to include, uhh, actual facts.
Chiro1523 just likes to say it. Again and again.
so, think there will be a game thread today?
Why would you not trust me?
of course I trust you