Kuroda to Dodgers
Alternate headline: “M’s lose out on Kuroda, plan franchise suicide.”
Hiroki Kuroda is signing with the Dodgers for three years and a reported $36 million, taking less money from L.A. than the M’s offered. I think they probably dodged a bullet here, personally – $12+ million per year for Kuroda just has no upside and a whole lot of downside.
However, since the M’s are intent on bringing in two veteran starters this winter and now have to go to Plan B, we’re going to here talk about two things – trading for Erik Bedard and signing one of the remaining mediocrities to a stupid contract. Just say no to Carlos Silva, Kyle Lohse, and pitchers of that ilk – the M’s simply don’t need any more overpaid pitch to contact veteran starters, despite the stupid cries about the requirements of upgrading the rotation.
I didn’t want Kuroda, but honestly, I have no faith in this organization to have any kind of real backup plan that isn’t simply panic based. I fully expect the rest of the offseason to be a total disaster. It doesn’t have to be, of course; Bartolo Colon’s still sitting out there, and they could actually work on improving the rest of their roster as well, but unfortunately, we don’t root for an organization that wise.
#48 – Short Answer: No – Long Answer: Heck no.
That is exactly what the whole argument is about a potential trade for Bedard is. Giving up literally all of our top prospects for a pitcher. Sure prospects bust, they do that on a daily basis, but out of those three, the chances of getting at least a single all-star caliber player are enough that I’d bet my house on it.
What do we get in return? A single stud (also injury risk) pitcher? Not worth it my friend, not at all.
Now if I went to the M’s website today and the headline is that the M’s traded for Bedard, I’d rather see something along the lines of:
Package #1
Jones or Morrow
Clement + 1 of anything else
Package #2
Jones or Morrow
3 of anything else but Clement.
Take your pick, there is plenty in the minors. Balentien, Chen, Butler, Aumont, Tillman maybe even Truinfel if the M’s are crazy.
Those are my personal daydreams. But I won’t be shocked when Bavasi announces Morrow, Jones, Clement and Truinfel for Bedard and a scrub.
48- I am not a fan of that, which means it should happen in about a week. I would rather build a defensive juggernaut and stick cheap arms on the mound. I hear Everett, Jenkins, and possibly McDonald are looking for work…
Thank you very much for the responses.
To be honest, Clement is not the best fit for the O’s since they just drafted Matt Wieters last year, unless they were planning on flipping him to another team to fill thier hole at SS. But the O’s need talent despite of possible redundancies.
I can’t imagine the M’s trading Jones and Balentien in the same deal. Jones is a slightly better fit, for the O’s, than Balentien because Jones can play CF.
Also wondering the opinion of M’s fans on whether Adam Jones can be moved back to SS, if the O’s were lucky enough to land him.
Lastly, and “inside source” on an O’s site had reported that there was an offer out there, don’t know if it was proposed by the O’s or M’s, of Jones, Morrow, Sherrill and Tony Butler for Bedard. who knows. thanks again for the responses.
BTW, I agree with all of your sentiments.
If I was an M’s fan I would want Bedard, but would be worried about his bolting after 09 and therefore wary of giving up so much talent.
I believe that Adam Everett has already signed with Twins. Choosing them over the O’s, who also supposedly had an offer out for him.
Buster Olney is saying Seattle is after Joe Blanton (via MLBTRs). He also mentions that Beane would demand Jones.
Cross our fingers that one isn’t true.
54- You are right, Thanks. I have been out of touch the last week.
56 – HamNasty, McDonald and Jenkins are still out there. From whose perspective are you looking at these players from? The M’s or the O’s. I’m assuming the M’s, but if so why the interest in guys like Everett and McDonald? Just curious.
Defense from the M’s perspective. I would be up for a Jenkins, Ichiro, Jones OF and sliding a McDonald into a platoon at 2nd and SS so we never have to watch Vidro play the field. If we can get anyone to take Sexson and Lopez keeps growing as a player(size not skill) maybe he turns into a 1st baseman and McDonald or Yuni takes 2nd. This is all moot though because Vidro, Ibanez, Sexson and HoRam are all going to be playing next year.
58 – Pure speculation, obviously, but I wonder if the O’s and M’s have any conversations on expanding the peramiters of a Bedard trade where Brian Roberts is included on our end and Sexson/Lopez are included on the M’s side. Not that it necessarily means anything, but Bavasi and McPhaill are supposed to be very close friends.
But, again, I guessing that Jones would have to be the centerpiece of any Bedard deal and I know you are not for that.
As an O’s fan I’m having Christmas visions of Jones patroling CF. In your opinion, though, could be be shifted back to SS? Or has that train sailed?
Thanks for your time.
59- I would be up for Roberts – Sexson/Lopez additions for sure.
The ship has sailed on Jones as a SS. He has grown into an OF’s body.
60 – The thing about taking on Sexson’s contract, however, is it would probably mean the O’s will get Jones and maybe, possibly, 2 out of Morrow/Clement/Balentien.
We’ll see, I’m probably being an over optimistic O’s fan. It’s fun to speculate.
That’s it. I’m officially buying a Playstation, or an X-Box for Christmas, now.
The issue with trading for Bedard has been addressed — I’d be for that in a heartbeat except that the M’s aren’t a single ace pitcher away from realistically contending. Given that we’re obviously (or at least we should obviously) be in rebuild mode, the point is to keep those prospects and hope to develop some sort of decent core. Additionally, Bedard is assuredly not going to sign a long term extension here in Seattle; at that juncture throwing all the beans away for Santana + extension would make far more sense then 2 years of Bedard.
That said, I won’t be surprised when we trade Aumont, Morrow, Jones, Clement and Truinfel (along with Balentien for good measure) for … Joe Blanton! It’s scary when the FO suckage makes that a fringe possibility.
62 – As an outsider, I see the M’s as a team that can contend for the AL West/Wildcard. But I’ll have to consent that you guys know your team a helluva lot better than I do. But thanks to all of you for humoring me with the Bedard talks. I learned a bunch.
64 – I meant 63. sorry.
64 – the 2008 Mariners will be competing for 2nd place at best (unless the Angel’s plane crashes), and 2nd place in the West is not going to cut it for the Wildcard. 2008 is 2007, with the old guys getting older and (hopefully) the young guys getting better. Considering the luck factor in their 2007 results and the FO’s irrational attachment to veterans, a repeat of 2007 is best case.
There’s a reason I finally dropped our season tickets this year after 6 years. I have zero confidence this team is going to sniff the playoffs anytime soon with this management group.
I don’t ever see the M’s acquiring Joe Blanton after the Blanton/Ichiro/Ellison debacle of last year. I suppose nobody is remembering that when talking about acquiring Blanton.
67 – Oh wow, I had completely forgotten about that. Personally I thought Ellison was suicidal because Blanton could probably snap him in half lol. Beane is going to ask for the sun and moon for Blanton especially if it’s in the division, I’d steer clear of that option if at all possible.
Ellis Carver: Hey we’re friendly folks. Good luck to your O’s next season. If you want to throw in Brian Roberts and get back Sexson/Lopez I’d definitely have to give it a much longer look.. still not sure I’d take it if it involved both Jones and Morrow going away.
Just a minor quibble with the final line of Dave’s comment.
Now, no offense whatsoever is intended to those fans who root for a franchise – if it adds to your enjoyment, however masochistic for spells (or in the case of the Cubs or Royals, decades), I am not even mildly surprised by your choice – there are plenty of BASEBALL fans who really love the game and hold a different perspective.
Fans like myself love the game (at any level) on the field, the history that sets up each game, particular players and personalities (as people and “legends”), and the teams that create and develop the narrative of the sport. The money-talk and the front office are almost never important to maintaining my interest, except out of necessity – the “business” of baseball as it is today is more and more the main obstacle to my enjoying the professional game.
I am interested in the shape a particular team takes much more than in winning and losing (though winning is more fun, in moderation, while losing has very limited charm for this fan) and therefore I simply have lost my taste for the current Mariners, though having my most favorite player Ichiro, as well as Johjima, and Beltre means I will be shadowing the team more closely than, say, the Diamondbacks or Marlins.
The current team is not much fun to watch (on TV at least), win or lose, and the apparant idiocy of the FO, and the succession of sickeningly awful managers, who actually interfere with what I see as the team’s “organi form” mean I finally gave up my “Mariners’ fan” status – not that anyine should care.
To say it more simply, I don’t give a flying f— about the publiser, I want to be able to enjoy the book.
May the Mariners find themselves, and find themselves under good management as well, in 2008!
67: Ahh, yes…but stranger things have happened. Remember when Clemens used to head-hunt A-Rod years ago — with words exchanged on occasion? It didn’t really preclude the Yanks from eventually winding up with both of them at the same time.
And I’ll bet those two never even mention that to each other these days, either.
70- Well that was all on account of Clemens Roid-Rage so A-Rod forgave him.
I totally agree with 45 that the main problem for the M’s is defense and that unless this is addressed, it really won’t matter who is in the rotation. Felix’s stats last year were absolutely destroyed by our defense….there’s no way someone with his stuff should be giving up over a hit an inning. With an adequate defense, Felix is the #1 starter we need. Hopefully, Bavasi will see this and go for some below-the-radar starters via trade, such as Howell or Jackson from Tampa Bay, and sign someone like Colon as a free agent.
I question whether Bavasi would consider trading Jones….who would we have in right field without him? Balentien? I just can’t imagine that Bavasi would be counting on that working out….
#72: Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, don’t jinx it. Remember last year. . .