<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: The 93-win team (more ZiPS fun)</title>
	<atom:link href="http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/</link>
	<description>Seattle Mariners and general baseball discussion with David Cameron and Derek Zumsteg</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 21 Nov 2009 14:00:02 -0800</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: DMZ</title>
		<link>http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/comment-page-2/#comment-252331</link>
		<dc:creator>DMZ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Feb 2008 05:36:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/#comment-252331</guid>
		<description>1. It&#039;s not a projection
2. It&#039;s not a projection that Oakland will be the AL West champions
3. It&#039;s not even a projection that Oakland *is* better than the Mariners

Go back up there are re-read the original post, where I talk about how the A&#039;s, in not having their actual injuries reflected, operated at a huge advantage.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>1. It&#8217;s not a projection<br />
2. It&#8217;s not a projection that Oakland will be the AL West champions<br />
3. It&#8217;s not even a projection that Oakland *is* better than the Mariners</p>
<p>Go back up there are re-read the original post, where I talk about how the A&#8217;s, in not having their actual injuries reflected, operated at a huge advantage.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: fermorules</title>
		<link>http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/comment-page-2/#comment-252322</link>
		<dc:creator>fermorules</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Feb 2008 04:22:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/#comment-252322</guid>
		<description>I enjoy your site, but I must say you lost me with your Oakland projection as AL West champions.

Brand me a hopeless simpleton incapable of intelligent analysis, but when I look at the Oakland club and then look at the Seattle club, I happen to like the Seattle club better.

Go ahead, laugh your heads off at my expense, but I don&#039;t care. The Seattle Mariners 2008 are better than the Oakland A&#039;s 2008.

And when you get done with your snickering, I have a proposition to make. If anybody cares to wager which team has the better record in 2008 I&#039;m willing to give you all the action you can afford.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I enjoy your site, but I must say you lost me with your Oakland projection as AL West champions.</p>
<p>Brand me a hopeless simpleton incapable of intelligent analysis, but when I look at the Oakland club and then look at the Seattle club, I happen to like the Seattle club better.</p>
<p>Go ahead, laugh your heads off at my expense, but I don&#8217;t care. The Seattle Mariners 2008 are better than the Oakland A&#8217;s 2008.</p>
<p>And when you get done with your snickering, I have a proposition to make. If anybody cares to wager which team has the better record in 2008 I&#8217;m willing to give you all the action you can afford.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Graham</title>
		<link>http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/comment-page-2/#comment-252295</link>
		<dc:creator>Graham</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Feb 2008 22:53:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/#comment-252295</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;WOW!!!
We have been MATHEMATICALLY eliminated…
This news will save me a lot of beer money at the Safe.&lt;/i&gt;

You are bad at wit. Stop trying.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>WOW!!!<br />
We have been MATHEMATICALLY eliminated…<br />
This news will save me a lot of beer money at the Safe.</i></p>
<p>You are bad at wit. Stop trying.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Robobobot</title>
		<link>http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/comment-page-2/#comment-252293</link>
		<dc:creator>Robobobot</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Feb 2008 22:46:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/#comment-252293</guid>
		<description>If 93 wins is the most for this year, what was the most for last year?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If 93 wins is the most for this year, what was the most for last year?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Evan</title>
		<link>http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/comment-page-2/#comment-252274</link>
		<dc:creator>Evan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Feb 2008 21:15:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/#comment-252274</guid>
		<description>Players who come from Japan are just like other new players in MLB - they&#039;re under club control for 6 years.

However, as free agents, players like Johjima have the leverage to wrest concession from their signing team, and thus eliminate teh 6 years of control.  We can safely assume that Johjima and other Japanese free agents have done exactly that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Players who come from Japan are just like other new players in MLB &#8211; they&#8217;re under club control for 6 years.</p>
<p>However, as free agents, players like Johjima have the leverage to wrest concession from their signing team, and thus eliminate teh 6 years of control.  We can safely assume that Johjima and other Japanese free agents have done exactly that.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: JMHawkins</title>
		<link>http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/comment-page-2/#comment-252195</link>
		<dc:creator>JMHawkins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Feb 2008 06:13:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/#comment-252195</guid>
		<description>Doh!.  I am a blockhead about blockqutoes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Doh!.  I am a blockhead about blockqutoes.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: lakelucerne</title>
		<link>http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/comment-page-2/#comment-252194</link>
		<dc:creator>lakelucerne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Feb 2008 05:45:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/#comment-252194</guid>
		<description>WOW!!!
We have been MATHEMATICALLY eliminated...
This news will save me a lot of beer money at the Safe.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>WOW!!!<br />
We have been MATHEMATICALLY eliminated&#8230;<br />
This news will save me a lot of beer money at the Safe.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: gwangung</title>
		<link>http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/comment-page-2/#comment-252193</link>
		<dc:creator>gwangung</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Feb 2008 05:06:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/#comment-252193</guid>
		<description>#62

If they&#039;re posted, they&#039;re under more years of control.

If they came over as free agents, as Joh did, at the end of the contratct, they&#039;re...free agents.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#62</p>
<p>If they&#8217;re posted, they&#8217;re under more years of control.</p>
<p>If they came over as free agents, as Joh did, at the end of the contratct, they&#8217;re&#8230;free agents.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: JMHawkins</title>
		<link>http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/comment-page-2/#comment-252192</link>
		<dc:creator>JMHawkins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Feb 2008 05:05:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/#comment-252192</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;i&gt;But the rest, yea - the M’s have never comprehended how good Jones is.&lt;/i&gt;

See, I never understood why. If the M’s were like Minnesota, a ‘tools’ inclined scouting department they shoulda loved him. If they were more stats analysis, like Oakland, there’s A LOT to love too. Baseball America likes him, BPro likes him… I just have a hard time grasping why they undervalued him so.

&lt;/blockquote

Hmmm.  I can think of a few possibilities that fit with the way the team has been run.

1) He&#039;s not a veteran.  Jones hadn&#039;t yet &quot;proven&quot; that he could make the jump from AAA, and in the miserly amount of playing time he got last year, he didn&#039;t shine.  I think the M&#039;s expect a rather high attrition rate among prospects trying to break into the Show, and I don&#039;t think they value minor league stats as much of an indicator.

2) TWO ACES!!!  The M&#039;s have a pitching fetish, or more specifically a Starting Pitching Fetish.  Look at how much money they have thrown at FA starters over the last few years.  Every year, they are chucking multi-year big money contracts at pitchers.  When they run out of money, they start throwing prospects or talented role players at other teams in exchange for starters.  Whatever value they placed on Jones wasn&#039;t enough to pull their vision away from a very shiny pitcher.  At least this time they got a top-shelf guy.  

3)  No understanding of Defense.  In some ways, I wonder if the M&#039;s have partially, but only partially, incorporated statistical analysis.  I mentioned before that the early days of stats were pretty bad at evaluating defense and tended to underrate its importance.  I get the sense the M&#039;s have made the move into an early-80&#039;s version of SABRmetrics, and both discount and mismeasure defense. 

4)  They hate batters who strike out (though, what explains Sesxon?).  They want guys to &quot;put the ball in play&quot; in order to &quot;make things happen.&quot;  Jones isn&#039;t the best fit for that philosophy.  

Basically, I think they undervalue things he is good at and overvalue things that he struggles with.&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p><i>But the rest, yea &#8211; the M’s have never comprehended how good Jones is.</i></p>
<p>See, I never understood why. If the M’s were like Minnesota, a ‘tools’ inclined scouting department they shoulda loved him. If they were more stats analysis, like Oakland, there’s A LOT to love too. Baseball America likes him, BPro likes him… I just have a hard time grasping why they undervalued him so.</p>
<p>&lt;/blockquote</p>
<p>Hmmm.  I can think of a few possibilities that fit with the way the team has been run.</p>
<p>1) He&#8217;s not a veteran.  Jones hadn&#8217;t yet &#8220;proven&#8221; that he could make the jump from AAA, and in the miserly amount of playing time he got last year, he didn&#8217;t shine.  I think the M&#8217;s expect a rather high attrition rate among prospects trying to break into the Show, and I don&#8217;t think they value minor league stats as much of an indicator.</p>
<p>2) TWO ACES!!!  The M&#8217;s have a pitching fetish, or more specifically a Starting Pitching Fetish.  Look at how much money they have thrown at FA starters over the last few years.  Every year, they are chucking multi-year big money contracts at pitchers.  When they run out of money, they start throwing prospects or talented role players at other teams in exchange for starters.  Whatever value they placed on Jones wasn&#8217;t enough to pull their vision away from a very shiny pitcher.  At least this time they got a top-shelf guy.  </p>
<p>3)  No understanding of Defense.  In some ways, I wonder if the M&#8217;s have partially, but only partially, incorporated statistical analysis.  I mentioned before that the early days of stats were pretty bad at evaluating defense and tended to underrate its importance.  I get the sense the M&#8217;s have made the move into an early-80&#8217;s version of SABRmetrics, and both discount and mismeasure defense. </p>
<p>4)  They hate batters who strike out (though, what explains Sesxon?).  They want guys to &#8220;put the ball in play&#8221; in order to &#8220;make things happen.&#8221;  Jones isn&#8217;t the best fit for that philosophy.  </p>
<p>Basically, I think they undervalue things he is good at and overvalue things that he struggles with.</p></blockquote>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: thefin190</title>
		<link>http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/comment-page-2/#comment-252190</link>
		<dc:creator>thefin190</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Feb 2008 04:50:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ussmariner.com/2008/02/10/the-93-win-team-more-zips-fun/#comment-252190</guid>
		<description>58 - That quote about Steve Phillips made me crack up. I always watch baseball tonight during the season, and love his expert advice (sarcasm). I remember last season during midseason he predicted the Mariners as the dark horse of the AL wild card. As much as I liked to national exposure for the Mariners, he couldn&#039;t be more wrong. 

Yea I would have to agree from a glance from an outside baseball fan, our team doesn&#039;t look bad. Once you look in, its a huge mess. Our rotation isn&#039;t terrible for the first time, but (correct me if I am wrong) it costs about $50 million dollars for the rotation. I don&#039;t know if the Yankmes can even boast a $50 million dollar rotation. I think they should try to have a rotation with more than one homegrown starter in their rotation, as well as develop hitters that can play defense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>58 &#8211; That quote about Steve Phillips made me crack up. I always watch baseball tonight during the season, and love his expert advice (sarcasm). I remember last season during midseason he predicted the Mariners as the dark horse of the AL wild card. As much as I liked to national exposure for the Mariners, he couldn&#8217;t be more wrong. </p>
<p>Yea I would have to agree from a glance from an outside baseball fan, our team doesn&#8217;t look bad. Once you look in, its a huge mess. Our rotation isn&#8217;t terrible for the first time, but (correct me if I am wrong) it costs about $50 million dollars for the rotation. I don&#8217;t know if the Yankmes can even boast a $50 million dollar rotation. I think they should try to have a rotation with more than one homegrown starter in their rotation, as well as develop hitters that can play defense.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
