Comments Back On
Dave · May 30, 2010 at 7:29 pm · Filed Under Mariners
I’ve re-enabled comments for now. If we have too many more instances like this weekend, I may just have to consider permanently disabling them. I know its a nice outlet for you guys to have your voices heard, but there are some comments that just should not be given a platform (such as the racist stupidity of Saturday’s game thread), and it’s a lot of work to keep up with the site 24/7 to keep the site free of that kind of drivel. Put simply, the reward has to be worth the effort, and that is on you guys to make the comments a place where conversation can flourish and serve as a place of insight and civility. Please do better.
That goes for you too, Mariners. Please do better.
Fair enough, eponymous coward, but I didn’t bother repeating the point someone made in a separate response: it’s not just this one game from which I am extrapolating, though I do see it as a microcosm of the inventiveness with which this team has lost all season. It predates my time as an Ms fan, so I ask out of intellectual curiosity: did the Tigers play themselves out of games which they were in a clear position to win, or was it the Ms’ good fortune to catch a good team as they came down off of an extraordinary hot streak and simply outplayed them?
Showing both my age and Midwest roots here…but, yes, that Tiger team in 1984 was very good. When they rolled into the Kingdome for that series, they’d just come off of two long winning streaks (including a sweep of the M’s in Detroit)…also, the M’s had the good fortune of not having to face Jack Morris during that Kingdome sweep — who had something like 13 wins by the AS break that year.
Interestingly, I’d heard a comparison once or twice during the 2001 season of the M’s to that ’84 Tiger team — in that they basically played like a machine that whole season and very rarely found ways to beat themselves…
I think this team could use a little of that *mojo* these days.
I just want to say “thank you” to Dave and DMZ (and the departed but not forgotten JMB, as well as all the more recent mods and contributors) for putting up with all the shit and keeping this site mostly sane, civil, and intelligent. I’ve been coming here a LONG time, and while I really appreciate the insightful posts, the commentary here really took my appreciation for USSM up several notches. I’d hate to see that go – though I know from personal experience that good & successful websites where people can go to comment, share, and get advice can simply dry up and go away if the people who enjoy the site don’t self-police. It’s just too much work for the mods.
With that said, on to the the M’s. I may be a deluded fool, but I am not throwing in the towell yet. This division is just bad/good enough that NOBODY will run away with the lead and I am beginning to think 85 wins will be enough to take the division, as teams take turns getting hot and then sucking/beating up on each other for stretches.
Yes, this team is awful as currently constructed and employed by Wak, but there ARE things to be optimistic about, even in the two losses this weekend. I do expect that Jack will be more proactive in June and July, and despite some good process-bad result moves this past offseason, I think his track record is one I can still have faith will produce positive changes.
I am NOT so deluded that I think there aren’t some immediate changes that need to be made. I think we 99% of us agree that Jesus Colome has never had a role on this team that makes sense, and he’s played his way out of the role that the remaining 1% thought he might have. Let’s start there. Step two – as painful and disrespectful as some might say it is – release Junior as soon as you identify ANY decent LH bat that can fill a platoon DH role and play a little bit of defense (preferably at 3B, where it may be time to recognize the need for at least a part-time platoon partner for Jose Lopez).
I’d be satisfied with those two things as a start – as long as it is only a start.
I don’t think you will have to worry about too many out of control commenters too much longer. This team is doing every thing in its power to drive away fans. Who comments on a game they didn’t watch and don’t care about?
The problem is the M’s are 19-30. That means they need to go 66-47 to get to 85 wins. That means they need to play like a 95 win team for the next 4 months to have a vanishingly small chance at a playoff spot; and I say vanishingly small because no team’s won the AL West with less than 88 wins over a full 162 game season, since the split into 3 divisions.
Oh, and the schedule for the next month is full of good teams.
It sucks to have to say this on Memorial Day, but the Mariners were in better position last year (they never went THIS far under .500), and couldn’t get over the hump. I’m not seeing how this happens this year, either.
Public apologies, Dave, for quoting some of the inappropriate comments that were tossed around on Saturday. I’d love to say that these events won’t happen again, but I can’t name an internet site that doesn’t deal with it on a daily basis. Just note that I’ll be more careful in the future, and thanks to you and your crew for the hard work maintaining the site.
Thanks.
Ditto. Thank you for all the work from all the people who manage this site and help make it a place that is fun, informative, and classy. Considering what day it is today, I am especially appreciative of these types of things. Go Ms!
I’m not a big fan of Buster Olney’s, but I think he was right when he said the Mariners shouldn’t throw in the towel – not because they’re good, but because the entire division is pretty bad.
But having said that… I have a hard time seeing this team as constructed and managed doing better than playing .500 ball between now and the end of the season – and that’s what I simply don’t get. I just can’t mentally reconcile the way Z and Wak operated last year with the way they’ve seemed to operate this year. Getting Lee, but then throwing 100+ at bats at an obviously done Griffey. Saying things like “we’re going with the hot bat”, but sitting Saunders for a week when he WAS the hot bat. Putting a premium on a flexible bench last year versus going with essentially no bench this year. And so on…
That is not an absurd premise. Figgins is 32. Sweeny was 32 when he went from all star to what many of you see as a useless puddle of love. Kotchman hasn’t ever hit. Lopez is the definition of over-swinging pull guy. Bradley had one big year, but has been inconsistent his whole career. This swoon could easily be more than just luck.
In the spirit of “constructive criticism”, let’s keep in mind just how bad the current Mariners bullpen is. Of all the Mariners who have relieved this season (and I use the term “relieved” loosely here), only three have positive WAR/RAR (see http://www.fangraphs.com/winss.aspx?team=Mariners&pos=all&stats=pit&qual=0&type=6&season=2010&month=0):
K. Texeira (1.9 RAR), S. White (1.0 RAR) and S. Kelley (0.9 RAR). All others are either at 0 RAR (Colome, Aardsma, Lowe) or negative (B. League, I. Snell, R. Rowland-Smith).
The first thing to do Wak in my opinion is to call up Chad Cordero and a hitter who hits like Everidge or Carp, and is more than certain that Tui can not hit major league. Colome is a bad pitcher, why keep on the roster?
Teixeira is to give it time, think it might be a good pitcher but please release Colome. Please send Tui to Tacoma with Teixeira and call up Cordero and Sean White, wait Mark Lowe come back.
David Aardsma is OK, Colome sucks, Tui sucks.
Brandon just needs confidence and a one inning just. The season is not over and I believe that change and hopefully the M’s can turn to the division. The Angels do not have to Morales, Texas is falling to pieces, Oakland is a matter of time to start losing games, the M’s have a great rotation, bullpen and only need one or better two hitters, and the division may be our
As much as I love free websites, this may be a good idea.
I presume that you’re talking about a one-time fee. Or do you mean $25 per year? If it’s per year, then maybe a lower figure would be better.
EC wrote:
I realize how daunting a task it is. And I am NOT suggesting that the Mariners, as currently constituted, are capable of it. But with a couple of tweaks and some progression to the mean from a few underperforming players, I don’t think it is an impossible task.
Just a couple of moderately impressive winning streaks (a couple of streaks of 5 or 6 wins), coupled with no corresponding losing streaks of more than a couple of games, makes it seem less daunting. And the shorter the amount of time that a team has to play at a clip we consider “over their heads” (like a 95-win clip), the better.
I’m trying hard to hang on to the hope here. I don’t think the bullpen is as bad as it has appeared lately. The starting pitching has been a strength, even with Felix not pitching up to what he is capable of. The offense has shown some signs of life in the last week or two, and I think it is reasonable to assume that Jack Z. will begin to address some of the systemic offensive woes of this team in the next 6-8 weeks – as soon as there are willing trade partners, really.
If the M’s can stay within 6-7 games through Father’s Day, I will remain optimistic. If they can’t, I’ll jump on the bandwagon of people rooting for a Cleveland-Montreal-esque trade involving Cliff Lee, and begin rooting for the second coming of the Strasburg Sweepstakes.
Well, today’s lineup has been posted – if you’re looking for change, this isn’t it. Tui is at first again, Bradley’s out in left, and Huggy Bear is at DH.
I really miss the spelling police on this site as well as the stricter comment moderation, but since those depend on volunteers sifting through a lot of stuff at all hours I can’t complain (and I haven’t stepped forward although I read this daily). Kudos to Dave, DMZ and the moderators over the years who made it so different from other blogs and message boards.
As for the team, I think in the end we will have to see this as part of a progression that goes something like:
Year 1, 2009: Stop the bleeding, use defense to improve the talent level and competitiveness, find some useful parts on the scrap heap, ride Felix, hug and tickle your way to 85 wins by winning more one-run games than you lose.
Year 2, 2010: Get rid of the rest of the crippling long-term big dollar contracts. Do this even if the overall talent level does not appreciably increase. Replace Beltre with Figgins. Gamble that Cliff Lee will help put the team over the top. Failing that, trade him for talent or take the draft choices. Get Ackley his minor league experience. Don’t expect another 85 wins even though expectations have been raised in the fan base. Swallow reversal on one-run games. Retire Griffey.
Year 3: Actually increase the talent level and put together a more viable long-term contender. Look to international scouting to catch up to the Rangers on young talent. Hope for continued Angel aging/malaise. Outspend Oakland, but not in Bavasi fashion.
There’s always next year.
And when Sean White happens to be one of those guys who’s supposedly “better” in that category, you know you’re in trouble.
Figgins is 32. Sweeny was 32 when he went from all star to what many of you see as a useless puddle of love.
Sweeney had major injury issues and was a slow 1B. Figgins is a fast infielder who doesn’t have the same issues.
Kotchman hasn’t hit very well during his career, but he’s not been THIS bad. And we all know Lopez has a) epic slumps and b) epic hot streaks.
I still think they aren’t all done as MLB hitters, given that their BABIP profile is either a) monstrously unlucky or b) completely done as baseball players. Oh, and they all play in Safeco, which is just the sort of run-depressing environment that helps slumps (see: Beltre, Adrian, and so on).
But with a couple of tweaks and some progression to the mean from a few underperforming players, I don’t think it is an impossible task.
Impossible? No. Unlikely? Yes. They aren’t a 95-100 win team on true talent, even if you do lots of wishful thinking on regression to the mean, adjusting the lineup and so on, but that’s how they have to play from now until season’s end to have a shot.
I don’t think it’s wrong to be hopeful… but one needs to be realistic about the chances here. (There’s also the factor that GMZ might get his best prices a week or two into June- and once the roster starts getting dismantled, the preseason projections of ~85 win true talent go out the window.)
Yes we had 85 wins last season but should we honestly expected the expectations we had? With Z cleaning up the Bavasi mess, we should expect to be contending by 2012. The Lee trade was a win-win for us because none of the prospects we gave up had that much of an impact. And we will get back more than we gave.