Game 93, White Sox at Mariners
Hudson vs Pauley, 7:10 pm.
These little blurbs become harder to write as the season wears on. I mean, I could spend a few minutes talking about David Pauley, but he’s a generic arm that probably won’t be in the organization in a few months, so what’s the point? So, instead, I’ll share a quick story.
Last week, I spent five days down in Anaheim covering the Futures Game and the All-Star Game for FanGraphs. The Wall Street Journal was kind enough to help me get a credential, so I milled with the media and did media stuff for a few days, hobnobbing with the likes of the great Larry Stone. It was certainly an interesting experience. The best part, though, was the Monday morning press conference when the managers announced the line-ups for the All-Star Game. Charlie Manuel, when announcing the NL line-up, said the following:
“Batting second, and playing second base, Martin Par-ough. Pair-doo. How do you say his name?”
Chuckles ensued, and then someone told Charlie how to pronounce Martin Prado’s last name. A minute or so later, he got to his starting catcher, who he called “Yeah-Dear” Molina. A few minutes later, he called his starting shortstop “Hansley”. Then, when a reporter asked him why he was starting Andre Ethier in center field (Ethier has the worst UZR of any outfielder in baseball this year and hadn’t played CF since college), he gave this incoherent rambling answer about Ethier having more votes. He then said something about not having a true center fielder, but that Ethier had played there recently, and so he could handle it. Of course, Ethier hadn’t played there recently; Manuel had either looked at the wrong player’s stat sheet (Corey Hart had played CF as recently as last year) or was just confusing the two players.
By the end of the press conference, I was convinced that Manuel knew less about the players on his team than every other person in that room, which is actually understandable. He’s pretty busy running his own team, after all. He’s 66 years old and one of the most country people involved in the sport (the word “bumpkin” was used to describe him several times last week), so I’d wager that he’s not exactly a wiz with the internet. None of the things he got wrong affect how he does his job. And, by all accounts, his players love him, so this isn’t any kind of criticism of Manuel’s qualifications to manage the Phillies.
But it was the most obvious indicator that if MLB wants fans to take the All-Star Game seriously, they should strongly consider just taking the players and managers out of the decision making process. Their job is not to effectively evaluate their peers, and when they try to do so, they’re generally terrible at it. Every time we get the results of some kind of player or manager voting, we usually have to strain to make it match reality. These guys are (mostly) good at what they do, but having a realistic perspective on the other 29 teams in the league is not what they do.
Give the votes strictly to the media – they’d do a much better job picking the All-Stars than the combination of players, managers, and fans. I stood in a room full of guys who knew that Ryan Howard had no business in Anaheim last week, and really had no business starting at DH against a left-handed pitcher, but they were the ones asking the question of “the insider” who didn’t know that. It was pretty interesting to watch. The media has gotten smarter at a much faster pace than the guys on the field.
Ichiro, RF
Figgins, 2B
Branyan, DH
Lopez, 3B
Gutierrez, CF
Bradley, LF
Smoak, 1B
Johnson, C
Jack Wilson, SS
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94 Responses to “Game 93, White Sox at Mariners”
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Now Kotch hit a double like Mccann!!
Can’t we pinch hit a clone of Justin Smoak for Krotchman?
I love when forums turn on the poster instead of sticking to the topic – a sure sign of toxic rah-rah.
I misspelled “gaffe”, big effin’ deal.
I do work for a baseball team btw. I’ll keep my citations to myself. I’m not posting here to be validated by anyone.
(People who roll their eyes can’t keep them focused on the picture right in front of them.
I would have at least thrown Bard out there. Kotch vs. Lefty throwing 97, great idea.
Its 18.8million sunk cost because Bradley gets 13.3, and the M’s are sending 5.5 to the Cubs in 2011.
Dave said this team is capable of winning 85 games or losing 100…it was dependent on best case/worst case scenario.
I think going to the shrink ruined Bradley. Maybe he needs to have a bad attitude to play well.
“Bang, zoom. Almost to the moon.”
-Dave Sims
I have also thought that, maybe Bradley is depressed for not appear on the covers of the blogs screaming or hitting someone …
Seriously, we had no better arms in Tacoma that we had to sign Wright?
Ya, only a quote most 50 year olds would get. Though I did watch the Honeymooners on nick at nite and I’m 32
Bradley is just imagining every pitch as a smiling zoloft cartoon. Who would wanna hurt those cute little guys?
Smoak had a little Griffey finish to that swing
Why are you posting here? In my experience, professional anythings rarely have time to hang out on blogs and offer their insights, particularly if they were in such a position that may be compromised by offering such opinions in a public forum.
Unless you’re like the Safeco groundskeeper or something.
I’m also intrigued by the phenomenon, seen more on places like the Times blog, but also here, where the best player on the team is singled out for derision and blame, as though they should somehow be able to lift and motivate 24 other men to perform beyond their abilities. Someone who’s wasting and squandering what abilities they did have, such as a Lopez, are a much better target, IMO, but perhaps there’s something psychological in it all.
And if you had been around here longer, Nellie, who’d know that we often wander off on tangents during game threads. Been that way for the five years or so I’ve hung out here. It’s one place the mods allow it, for one thing. But since you’re just one of those guys who bursts into blogs with a big old I’M HERE AND I KNOW EVERYTHING ‘tude, you haven’t had time to observe that yet. And that there’s a real emphasis on proofreading your posts.
I think we should spend less time worrying about anything the manager of the NL All-star team does… and more time worrying about how to get the manager of your Mariners to stop hitting Jose Lopez 4th. How’s that mystery coming along?
Getting passed the troll…
I really think Wak has lost this team. The sloppy play in the field and the basepaths screams a team that isn’t focused.
I would not be surprised to see some ugliness come out of the clubhouse in the next week or so.
I could be batting 4th in the lineup and hitting .000, and it wouldn’t matter all that much.
Put Pujols on this team, and it’s still a well-under-.500 team.
Wright probably had the frequent flier miles, so we made him buy his own seat.
Brutal
On the pace to lose 99.
Branyan out with a hurt back.
Can we just surrender now, take the losses, and not risk any more injuries?
Maybe have the MLB teams come down and play the Rainiers, so that the games don’t count for Pineda’s and Ackley’s service time?
It’s spelled “past.”
The surest sign of denial is chirping the infamous “troll” call. As unique as batting Lopez 4th.
Rock on, geniuses.
I don’t know about Brignac. His BB/K ratio is pretty bad. Now that Inge is hurt, now is the time to try to swing Lopez to Detroit. We had our shot with Philly but dilly-dallied until Polanco came back. I’d rather deal Lopez than Jack, JW was never supposed to be a run producer in the first place. Lopez on the other hand…
He’s a leadoff guy. What, is he supposed to drive himself in? Blame the guys who hit behind him for not doing their jobs. Ichiro is one of the few guys pulling their weight this season.
My apologies Mr. Bavasi.
Oh snap I just got back from watching paint dry. The M’s played tonight???
*checks score*
oh. Time to go watch grass grow.
Veteran baseball guy huh…
Bavasi? Is that you? Ladies and gentleman, Bill Bavasi.
You’re the one who brought up the sharp new topic. Hazard of the occupation. And if you know anything about us and this site, we are neither fan-boys nor unpaid PR men.
Funny….I remember a week or so ago (when you had a knot in your knickers about Ichiro ‘sexually assaulting a fan’- which still blows my mind how you’d get that from the video) you identified yourself as a schoolteacher.
Not many schoolteachers I know (and I’m the child of two of ’em) have the time to be working for any kind of professional baseball club on the side.
So which one is it?
BTW, trade insults with others here as you please- but suppositions such as ‘Ichiro’s overrated’ and ‘Ichiro’s hurting the team’- these are suppositions wherein the proof rests on you to provide.
And it’s been that way since this site’s beginning.
All you’ve really done is sling mud in the direction of dissenters. Not convincing.
So go ahead, man. TELLLLLLL us exactly how Ichiro’s overrated and been coddled yadda yadda yakety-schmakety.
I’m listening for a cogent argument, and so are a bunch of us here,I’d say.
As for the self-proclaimed non-need for validation? I snicker at the sheer amount of effort being put into this by you, then.
Spelling Bee’s and spitting contests huh … it has been a long season hasn’t it?
In respect to Nellie’s right to an opinion: You may not agree with it, because it comes out with flames surrounding it (sometimes) – but if Ichiro wasn’t fast, would anybody say he is a good baseruner? He makes a lot of mistakes on the bases. I am constantly having a similar discussion about Ichiro’s baserunning habits with my dad – who is 70 and used to umpire pro ball. I find myself defending Ichiro quite often – but some of his mistakes are hard to overlook.
I have no idea how old Nellie is, but there is a generation of baseball fans that hates strikeouts and hates baserunning blunders. There are only 27 outs in a game … and they are precious. The most precious commodity you have in a game. The Mariners throw a lot of outs away – and that bothers a lot of people. Pure sloppiness if nothing else.
I don’t know if Ichiro’s error rate on the bases is any higher or lower than your average leadoff hitter, because I am not watching any other leadoff hitters 162 times per year, but Ichiro makes his fair share of mistakes on the bases.
In regard to the other points of passion from Nellie’s post – I can’t say I agree … other than from this standpoint: When I ask a question in a meeting at work and everyone is nodding their head “yes” except for one person … I will make sure to listen to that one person’s opinion. I don’t need parrots … I need opinions.
The Site is too good to get hung up on a typo now and then. Keep the passion though … love the passion.
The good news is that I only have tickets to two more games. The bad news is that I have tickets to two more games. The effort tonight was putrid. 2001: Two outs, so what.
2010: Bases loaded, so what.
As a two-time Cy Young winner, Nobel Laureate, and ex-lover of Cindy Crawford, I find Felix’s loafing inexcusable and Cliff Lee’s inability to pitch every 3rd game while with the Mariners downright sickening. Pitching? This organization needs to learn the definition of pitching. And enough excuses with their inability to select future Hall-of-Fame hurlers each year in the draft.
He mentions 40 years of baseball analysis, which if taken in context of interest in the game coming in youth like it does for a lot of us, places him at quite possible late-40s or early-50s.
I’m not a fan of strikeouts or baserunning blunders, either. We have got to be the worst situational-hitting team in baseball this year.
And Ichiro has always made his fair share of baserunning mistakes in the major leagues. You’re right about that, Mike.
But I’m not trying to absolve him of that. I’m just saying his value is more than Nellie’s stating.
I liked the quote and I keep laughing when I read it. I might be tired, but …. no, it’s just damn funny.
So, survey time … in what inning will the Mariners score their 1 run tomorrow night? I am going with the 4th inning.
Oh, and I forgot to mention that darned Ichiro! and his +48.5 WAR since joining the M’s. That’s a paltry 5 WAR per year from 2001-09.
I’m not going to go into detail, but mod tools give no reason to indicate that Nellie is telling the truth.
You’re all very surprised, I know.
And yes, Nellie claimed to be a high school teacher in this thread.
Nellie is trying way too hard to establish credibility
I hear ya bru … and I agree with you. I think almost everyone agrees with you – and the Ichiro “value” argument gets done to death … but I agree with you.
In terms of value, Ichiro is worth his $18M minus deferrments plus COLA adjustments pro-rated – in a single day – to the MARINER ORGANIZATION. They market virtually everything around the guy (not directed at you Son … you already know this). He is a great player, but not without his own flaws. He is the best player we have. He will get over 3000 hits (someday) and all in a Mariner uniform. There will be a statue of him outside of Safeco someday.
Maybe Nellie occasionally conducts a brief sociology experiment on USSM nation to see what kind of response he can get – to determine if there is any sleep deprivation caused as a result.
I like the fact that he isn’t afraid to state his opinion when he knows he is going to get blasted for stating it. It would be a much more defendable argument on his part if he were to do it when Ichiro is hitting .350 and in the middle of a hot streak, instead of hitting a very un-Ichiro like .315, but that’s up to Nellie.
Well it’s time for me to come clean…
I am Ichiro. Quit judging me based on stats that are dependent on the performance of other players.
Domo arigato.
Awesome!
Be sure to tip your waiters and waitresses on behalf of “Westside guy.”
Nellie
I have brought up similar criticisms of Ichiro without the flames. Clean up the delivery and most will read it with more objectivity……..It also doesn’t help when you accuse Ichiro of sexual assault/harassment.
I agree with spankystout, I went through my anti-Ichiro phase last week and got pretty legitimate responses.
And now that I realize it was just angry/frustrated ranting on my part, I’m seeing more clearly now. Ichi isn’t the problem, the 21 players on this team not named Ichiro, Felix, Jason, and Franklin are…
3rd inning, Jack Wilson home run. Solo shot. 3-1 count. Inner-half fastball that catches too much of the plate.
But I think Smoak hits a double and gets a rib, too. And Figgins (FIGGINS!) gets an RBI as well.
And we’ll win 3-2.
Jack Wilson – home run call … with a follow-up Figgins RBI prediction?!
Man, if you get that one correct … you will have to be upgraded and forever be known as the Father-Son-and-Holy Spirit-of-Zavaras.
What would be more suprising, Wilson hitting a homer or taking a walk?
Taking a walk, easy. Those things are as rare to him as Atlantis sightings!